Labour MSPs will have their weekly meeting at Holyrood this lunchtime, and it's a fair guess that they might be asking what on earth is going on with their leader's referendum tactics. The recent twists were intended to close down the disagreement with Downing Street, or at least to reach some sort of equilibrium in that disagreement. But I don't think I'm the only one who remains confused.
Let's recap:
SUNDAY 4: Wendy Alexander says 'bring it on'.
MONDAY: Wendy says the referendum should be 'yes/no'.
TUESDAY: A Labour MSP group meeting ends with the convener, Duncan McNeil, saying the party will not block any referendum Bill coming before Parliament. Wendy says she might table her own referendum Bill, and says on TV she has Gordon Brown's backing for her stance.
(Note the arithmetic: If the 46 Labour MSPs abstain, the SNP should get a Bill through: 47 Nationalists + 2 Greens + 1 Margo = 50. 16 LibDem + 16 Conservatives = 32.)
WEDNESDAY: Asked if he backs her stance, Gordon Brown conspicuously fails to do so, setting out another stance of waiting until the Calman Commission reports next year, and then figuring out what to do. It becomes clear that a Labour Bill would be blocked, because it would be on a subject on which the Government intends to legislate.
THURSDAY: Wendy wades into the controversy again, challenging Alex Salmond to hold a referendum as soon as possible – laying bare the rift with Gordon Brown.
FRIDAY: Douglas Alexander sides with his boss rather than his sister. The Scotland Office remains strangely silent.
SATURDAY: At the Scottish Labour executive meeting, Wendy says the SNP has failed to rise to the challenge of bringing forward the referendum, it has been outfoxed by Labour. It looks like she has been told to close down the rift, until...
SUNDAY: While Gordon Brown tells the Sunday Telegraph he is "not persuaded" of the case for a referendum, Wendy's back on the BBC TV programme on which she started this off, saying that Labour will not block the SNP's referendum bill in 2010, but there is no blank cheque, and that there is room for disagreement over the timing and the wording.
Alex Salmond, meanwhile, lets it be known he intends to launch the Scottish Government's referendum bill on Burns' birthday, January 25, 2010, and hold the referendum by the end of October that year, which would leave six clear months before the 2011 Holyrood elections.
MONDAY: Malcolm Chisholm is once again required to explain the incoherent. Like Iain Gray, he has provided media service above and beyond the call of duty, while Wendy Alexander's female chums – Jackie Baillie, Margaret Curran, Pauline McNeill – have gone quiet.
TODAY: MSPs could reasonably ask their leader at lunchtime today what it is they are supposed to go out and defend, and what it is she expects them to do when Salmond tables his Bill:
Is Labour now in favour of a referendum or not?
If Alex Salmond tabled a referendum Bill now, would it be supported or let through by Labour?
If Alex Salmond tables one in 2010, as he intends, on what conditions about the timing and the wording would Labour support it or let it through?
If Labour does not get any amendments through, would it abstain at Stage 3 of the Bill or vote to block the referendum?
When Duncan McNeil said Labour would not block "any referendum Bill", did he get that wrong?
Although Labour MSPs will almost certainly approve a statement on which they can all agree, I would be pleasantly surprised if these questions are answered with any clarity after today's meeting.
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Alex Salmond may have read the smile wiped off his face when he read the Daily Express yesterday. The tabloid is now the most pro-SNP title of all, but it did the First Minister no favours by saying he intended to go out and mingle with the people across "his realm" as James V did some years back. Labour's Jackie Baillie (so she can still talk!) was quick to pounce on the First Minister now comparing himself with royalty.
Douglas,
You raise a number of good questions that the Labour party should be asking of their "leader".
However, given the absolute pantomime of the last week or so I would suspect that the answers will be more akin to "oh yes he did !" "oh no she didn't !" or probably more likely "look out ! he's behind you!!!"
Douglas,
You raise a number of good questions that the Labour party should be asking of their "leader".
However, given the absolute pantomime of the last week or so I would suspect that the answers will be more akin to "oh yes he did !" "oh no she didn't !" or probably more likely "look out ! he's behind you!!!"
[quote] Labour's Jackie Baillie (so she can still talk!) was quick to pounce on the First Minister now comparing himself with royalty”.[/quote]
Wouldn't want to get pounced on by jackie, might not recover from that!
Hopefully after today there will be a clear idea of what labour's policy is on the matter. As it is i don't think even the bendy one herself knows. I do, however, believe (same as george) that the referendum will be voted down in 2010. By that point i believe the SNP government will have won alot of people round to the idea of independence and the unionists will be unwilling to gamble o the union.
P.S are you trying to get rid of us nats over to the express??
Labour's Jackie Baillie (so she can still talk!) was quick to pounce on the First Minister now comparing himself with royalty”.
Wouldn't want to get pounced on by jackie, might not recover from that!
Hopefully after today there will be a clear idea of what labour's policy is on the matter. As it is i don't think even the bendy one herself knows. I do, however, believe (same as george) that the referendum will be voted down in 2010. By that point i believe the SNP government will have won alot of people round to the idea of independence and the unionists will be unwilling to gamble o the union.
P.S are you trying to get rid of us nats over to the express??
re: "Jackie Baillie was quick to pounce"
Now there's an image that will put you off your tea.
Meanwhile back at the Bendy Wendy cave in the deepest part of the Holyrood parliament. I expect that Wendy will come up with a wheeze that will consist of denying that she called for a early referendum, deny too that she did said "bring it on", also deny that Labour MSPs would back a SNP referendum bill and finally deny that the voice of the Scottish people need to be heard on this matter. Backing Wendy Alexander on this will be Jackie Baillie who pounce on any journalist who dares to say that Wendy is a liar.
re: "Jackie Baillie was quick to pounce"
Now there's an image that will put you off your tea.
Meanwhile back at the Bendy Wendy cave in the deepest part of the Holyrood parliament. I expect that Wendy will come up with a wheeze that will consist of denying that she called for a early referendum, deny too that she did said "bring it on", also deny that Labour MSPs would back a SNP referendum bill and finally deny that the voice of the Scottish people need to be heard on this matter. Backing Wendy Alexander on this will be Jackie Baillie who pounce on any journalist who dares to say that Wendy is a liar.
[quote][bold]megz[/bold] wrote:
[quote] Labour's Jackie Baillie (so she can still talk!) was quick to pounce on the First Minister now comparing himself with royalty”.[/quote] Wouldn't want to get pounced on by jackie, might not recover from that! Hopefully after today there will be a clear idea of what labour's policy is on the matter. As it is i don't think even the bendy one herself knows. I do, however, believe (same as george) that the referendum will be voted down in 2010. By that point i believe the SNP government will have won alot of people round to the idea of independence and the unionists will be unwilling to gamble o the union. P.S are you trying to get rid of us nats over to the express??[/quote] They will know that voting it down = even heavier loss in Scottish Election. It will be interesting to watch them tie themselves in knots over this one.
megz wrote:
Labour's Jackie Baillie (so she can still talk!) was quick to pounce on the First Minister now comparing himself with royalty”.
Wouldn't want to get pounced on by jackie, might not recover from that! Hopefully after today there will be a clear idea of what labour's policy is on the matter. As it is i don't think even the bendy one herself knows. I do, however, believe (same as george) that the referendum will be voted down in 2010. By that point i believe the SNP government will have won alot of people round to the idea of independence and the unionists will be unwilling to gamble o the union. P.S are you trying to get rid of us nats over to the express??
They will know that voting it down = even heavier loss in Scottish Election. It will be interesting to watch them tie themselves in knots over this one.
Mr Fraser,
Regards your last paragraph..
I'm sure our First Minister Alex Salmond won't be concerned with small talk. Water off a ducks back.
Hi George Laird, have you a chip on your shoulder....
I tend to like your posts. Normally factual and a good read... Your latest is not one of your best in my opinion... Cheers
Mr Fraser,
Regards your last paragraph..
I'm sure our First Minister Alex Salmond won't be concerned with small talk. Water off a ducks back.
Hi George Laird, have you a chip on your shoulder....
I tend to like your posts. Normally factual and a good read... Your latest is not one of your best in my opinion... Cheers
Posted by: George Laird at 3:38pm on Wed 14 May 08
Dear Puskas
Have a chip on my shoulder?
No, I don't think so but have been described as blunt.
As to you tending to like my posts, thank you and I hope you will continue to enjoy them but please read them quick as some get pulled by the Herald who don't like working class people being too honest.
I would have asked what part you take issue with, but unfortunately someone pulled my post.
I stand by ever word of that one but also I reserve my god given right to let rip with a rant of epic proportions for my own personal amusement.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Dear Puskas
Have a chip on my shoulder?
No, I don't think so but have been described as blunt.
As to you tending to like my posts, thank you and I hope you will continue to enjoy them but please read them quick as some get pulled by the Herald who don't like working class people being too honest.
I would have asked what part you take issue with, but unfortunately someone pulled my post.
I stand by ever word of that one but also I reserve my god given right to let rip with a rant of epic proportions for my own personal amusement.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Posted by: George Laird at 3:49pm on Wed 14 May 08
Dear Douglas Fraser
I am writing to complain that my post was pulled off your blog!
It was an absolute classic, it was funny, witty and importantly visionary.
If you could ask the "spanners" in your work to stop it, I would be most grateful.
I would like to remind you that in 2010 the referendum vote will be voted down by Labour et al.
Finally I was going to write a funny piece about Alexander kicking you up the deffer and her foot getting stuck but the Herald is not ready and not moved on enough in a changing Scottish landscape.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Dear Douglas Fraser
I am writing to complain that my post was pulled off your blog!
It was an absolute classic, it was funny, witty and importantly visionary.
If you could ask the "spanners" in your work to stop it, I would be most grateful.
I would like to remind you that in 2010 the referendum vote will be voted down by Labour et al.
Finally I was going to write a funny piece about Alexander kicking you up the deffer and her foot getting stuck but the Herald is not ready and not moved on enough in a changing Scottish landscape.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University