Chancellor debates breaking PM’s ‘golden rule’
A key element of the UK Government's claims of economic competence is at risk of crumbling as Chancellor Alistair Darling considers breaking one of the "golden rules" on borrowing levels.
Facing grim economic times and already close to the self-imposed ceiling set for government borrowing of 40% of national income, Mr Darling said yesterday the fiscal rules are now "under review", although he suggested a report that looser rules are already being drafted was "pure speculation".
He insisted no decision has been taken on whether the fiscal rules can be relaxed to allow more borrowing.
Official figures yesterday showed net borrowing hit a record £24.4bn in the first quarter of the financial year.
Balancing the nation's books requires that ministers choose between raising tax, breaking the rules or rewriting them.
Conservatives warned the change would mean "the end of the Brown era of economics", with Shadow Chancellor George Osborne saying the rules were being ditched as soon as economic difficulties put Labour to the test.
When he was chancellor, Gordon Brown staked his credibility on the rules when he announced them in 1997.
They were the key elements of the financial constraints he imposed on himself in order to build his reputation for prudence and competence.
Today's figures from the Office for National Statistics showed net debt at 38.3% of gross domestic product, up one percentage point on a year ago.
Including the government's added exposure from having taken over Northern Rock, plus the Bank of England credit line to avoid a stalling of bank lending, the ratio of borrowing goes up to 44.2%.
As growth stalls and the UK economy risks recession, that proportion could rise sharply, particularly if rising unemployment and welfare costs increase government costs.
That would break another of the golden rules, requiring that Mr Darling only borrows money to invest. But to depend either on tax increases or spending cuts to avoid breaking the rules would be likely to worsen the economic downturn.
Quarterly net borrowing was £9.6bn higher than the equivalent period last year, after a figure of £9.2bn was recorded for last month alone - the highest for June since monthly records began in 1993.
In a BBC interview yesterday, Mr Darling hinted at a rethink by pointing out government borrowing levels in Britain were currently lower than in most other major economies, including France, Germany, Italy and the US.
He added: "Of course it is right - especially now when our economy along with every other economy in the world is being hit by two shocks, the credit crunch and very high oil prices - that we allow borrowing to support the economy.
"But what is critical is that you do have rules to ensure public finances are sustain-able in the medium term. That is why rules are so important now and why they will remain important in the future."
Mr Osborne said: "The Brown era of economics is over. He staked his credibility on the fiscal rules. They were part of the arrangement he announced a decade ago to constrain government and make sure that money was put aside in the good years to prepare for the bad years.
"Now we've reached those bad years, the public finances are in a mess, and the rules are being ditched. It's like giving the prisoner the keys to their own prison cell."
Liberal Democrat Treasury spokesman Vince Cable said the rules should be put in the hands of an independent body to stop the government "fiddling" the figures.
"The fiscal rules have no credibility when the government keeps changing them," he added.
Robert Chote, director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, said: "The government would perhaps have been better off rethinking how these rules should look rather before the point at which it looks as though you are just about to break them."
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Posted by: george alexander, north lanarkshire on 11:25pm Fri 18 Jul 08
Even though he's allowed comments at last, I don't think I'll bother ..... this one aside.
Even though he's allowed comments at last, I don't think I'll bother ..... this one aside.
Posted by: JohnM, Perth on 11:31pm Fri 18 Jul 08
Rules are only effective if they're abided by! This exposes Brown and Darling's handling of the economy as a thin tissue with no substance apart from credit of course to which they still seem to be absolutely addicted.
We have not hard one proposal yet of any weight which will reduce public spending which would then get us back within Labour's own self-imposed rules. This probably means that there is still a massive amount of unnecessary spending to cut beyond that. Forget ID cards and all the other fripperies - that stuff's in the bin!
Like George I almost went into a frenzy of apathy before commenting but felt it had to be said anyway.
Rules are only effective if they're abided by! This exposes Brown and Darling's handling of the economy as a thin tissue with no substance apart from credit of course to which they still seem to be absolutely addicted.
We have not hard one proposal yet of any weight which will reduce public spending which would then get us back within Labour's own self-imposed rules. This probably means that there is still a massive amount of unnecessary spending to cut beyond that. Forget ID cards and all the other fripperies - that stuff's in the bin!
Like George I almost went into a frenzy of apathy before commenting but felt it had to be said anyway.
Posted by: Alex Porter, TROLL FREE SCOTLAND on 11:32pm Fri 18 Jul 08
This from Iain Dale:
[bold]Gordon's Imperfect Economic Storm Approaches
Iain Dale 8:23 PM[/bold]
[quote]An economic shudder has just run down my spine. I just read THIS on the BBC website. In June public borrowing reached a massive £9.16 billion. That's £9.16 billion of Her Majesty's Pounds. It's also 24% more than Treasury forecasts. In the first quarter of this financial year, the government borrowed more than £24 billion. Annualise it, and the government will be borrowing close on £100 billion this year - a seventh of all government spending. No wonder Alistair Darling is seeking to rewrite his own rules. In case you think I am being over dramatic, government borrowing is at its highest since April 1946.
Inflation is set to rocket. Unemployment is increasing. The Balance of Trade is at its worst level ever. The PSBR is out of control. And this is all before the recession has really started to bite. Have I missed anything?
If this sort of financial management goes on, I dread to think what kind of financial situation the Conservatives may inherit in May 2010.[/quote]
And to think Scotland is in surplus, mmm.
[italic]BBC Source: http://news.bbc.co.u
k/1/hi/business/7513
309.stm[/italic]
This from Iain Dale:
Gordon's Imperfect Economic Storm Approaches
Iain Dale 8:23 PM
An economic shudder has just run down my spine. I just read THIS on the BBC website. In June public borrowing reached a massive £9.16 billion. That's £9.16 billion of Her Majesty's Pounds. It's also 24% more than Treasury forecasts. In the first quarter of this financial year, the government borrowed more than £24 billion. Annualise it, and the government will be borrowing close on £100 billion this year - a seventh of all government spending. No wonder Alistair Darling is seeking to rewrite his own rules. In case you think I am being over dramatic, government borrowing is at its highest since April 1946.
Inflation is set to rocket. Unemployment is increasing. The Balance of Trade is at its worst level ever. The PSBR is out of control. And this is all before the recession has really started to bite. Have I missed anything?
If this sort of financial management goes on, I dread to think what kind of financial situation the Conservatives may inherit in May 2010.
And to think Scotland is in surplus, mmm.
BBC Source: http://news.bbc.co.u
k/1/hi/business/7513
309.stm Posted by: mike, London on 11:35pm Fri 18 Jul 08
Brown and Darling have certainly put us between a Northern Rock and an hard place,incompetent fools.All this money missing,perhaps they would like to tell us who's got it.
Brown and Darling have certainly put us between a Northern Rock and an hard place,incompetent fools.All this money missing,perhaps they would like to tell us who's got it.
Posted by: soloman, Stirling on 11:35pm Fri 18 Jul 08
Official figures yesterday showed net borrowing hit a record £24.4bn in the first quarter of the financial year.
Northern Rock!
Mr Brown set himself up for all his kickings bringing in new rules announced with his authority that evreyone believed, just like WOMD the people believed the (New Labour) spin and lies, I remember being full of it when they announced the attack of Iraq, my wife argued furiously with me,regards Iraq but like an idiot I'm ashamed to say I followed the gang.
Nothing will surprise me as this domino effect kicks in and the whole thing falls apart.
Official figures yesterday showed net borrowing hit a record £24.4bn in the first quarter of the financial year.
Northern Rock!
Mr Brown set himself up for all his kickings bringing in new rules announced with his authority that evreyone believed, just like WOMD the people believed the (New Labour) spin and lies, I remember being full of it when they announced the attack of Iraq, my wife argued furiously with me,regards Iraq but like an idiot I'm ashamed to say I followed the gang.
Nothing will surprise me as this domino effect kicks in and the whole thing falls apart.
Posted by: Iainbroch, Moray on 11:36pm Fri 18 Jul 08
Oh well game is up for Broonie! What a shame - not! The city of London sharks will turn on Labour big time - the feeding frenzy of the most ruthless vicious sub speices of homo sapiens will be something to behold!
Oh well game is up for Broonie! What a shame - not! The city of London sharks will turn on Labour big time - the feeding frenzy of the most ruthless vicious sub speices of homo sapiens will be something to behold!
Posted by: The Judge, Paisley on 12:29am Sat 19 Jul 08
Hi there Unionists!
Here is a fact you might like to conjure with!
Every Labour Government since time began has left office with the UK owing more money than when they came to power.
What you are about to witness is it happening all over again.The "good years" from the Iron Chancellor have been financed by debt with all these years of boom and nothing saved for the rainy day that was always coming.
The New Labour plan is now to survive to the next election (as far away as possible from the PM with the lowest ever approval rating...15% of the British people) with increased borrowing.
The plan is simple, build up increasing debt so Labour can blame the Tories when they have to increase taxes to try and clear up the mess.
I am not a Tory, I am a nationalist but I recognise a political party reaching rock bottom, that has sold out any principle it ever had and it reinforces my belief that Scotland, if it possibly can, should have no part of it.
Anyone who votes Labour in Glasgow East really needs to pay more attention to what is going on!
A vote for Labour means a Tory Government, increased taxes to clear up the Labour mess and more years wasted when we could have been building a better Scotland rather than be tied in to the failings of a post imperialist disaster area!
Hi there Unionists!
Here is a fact you might like to conjure with!
Every Labour Government since time began has left office with the UK owing more money than when they came to power.
What you are about to witness is it happening all over again.The "good years" from the Iron Chancellor have been financed by debt with all these years of boom and nothing saved for the rainy day that was always coming.
The New Labour plan is now to survive to the next election (as far away as possible from the PM with the lowest ever approval rating...15% of the British people) with increased borrowing.
The plan is simple, build up increasing debt so Labour can blame the Tories when they have to increase taxes to try and clear up the mess.
I am not a Tory, I am a nationalist but I recognise a political party reaching rock bottom, that has sold out any principle it ever had and it reinforces my belief that Scotland, if it possibly can, should have no part of it.
Anyone who votes Labour in Glasgow East really needs to pay more attention to what is going on!
A vote for Labour means a Tory Government, increased taxes to clear up the Labour mess and more years wasted when we could have been building a better Scotland rather than be tied in to the failings of a post imperialist disaster area!
Posted by: The Judge, Paisley on 12:34am Sat 19 Jul 08
Unionists you have got to admit I am fair.
I did not even mention the PFI/PPP con that is going to cost us all a fortune and is not even on the books and therefore is not even counted in the golden rule calculations...yet we will be paying for years to come!
Unionists you have got to admit I am fair.
I did not even mention the PFI/PPP con that is going to cost us all a fortune and is not even on the books and therefore is not even counted in the golden rule calculations...yet we will be paying for years to come!
Posted by: Steve A, Independence for Scotland! on 12:56am Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote][bold]The Judge[/bold] wrote:
Hi there Unionists! Here is a fact you might like to conjure with! Every Labour Government since time began has left office with the UK owing more money than when they came to power. What you are about to witness is it happening all over again.The "good years" from the Iron Chancellor have been financed by debt with all these years of boom and nothing saved for the rainy day that was always coming. The New Labour plan is now to survive to the next election (as far away as possible from the PM with the lowest ever approval rating...15% of the British people) with increased borrowing. The plan is simple, build up increasing debt so Labour can blame the Tories when they have to increase taxes to try and clear up the mess. I am not a Tory, I am a nationalist but I recognise a political party reaching rock bottom, that has sold out any principle it ever had and it reinforces my belief that Scotland, if it possibly can, should have no part of it. Anyone who votes Labour in Glasgow East really needs to pay more attention to what is going on! A vote for Labour means a Tory Government, increased taxes to clear up the Labour mess and more years wasted when we could have been building a better Scotland rather than be tied in to the failings of a post imperialist disaster area![/quote] Nail firmly hit on head Judge.
The Judge wrote:
Hi there Unionists! Here is a fact you might like to conjure with! Every Labour Government since time began has left office with the UK owing more money than when they came to power. What you are about to witness is it happening all over again.The "good years" from the Iron Chancellor have been financed by debt with all these years of boom and nothing saved for the rainy day that was always coming. The New Labour plan is now to survive to the next election (as far away as possible from the PM with the lowest ever approval rating...15% of the British people) with increased borrowing. The plan is simple, build up increasing debt so Labour can blame the Tories when they have to increase taxes to try and clear up the mess. I am not a Tory, I am a nationalist but I recognise a political party reaching rock bottom, that has sold out any principle it ever had and it reinforces my belief that Scotland, if it possibly can, should have no part of it. Anyone who votes Labour in Glasgow East really needs to pay more attention to what is going on! A vote for Labour means a Tory Government, increased taxes to clear up the Labour mess and more years wasted when we could have been building a better Scotland rather than be tied in to the failings of a post imperialist disaster area!
Nail firmly hit on head Judge.
Posted by: Vote for Scotlands Future, Vote for the SNP on 12:57am Sat 19 Jul 08
Shows how incompetent Labour are at managing books, when they have a record windfall of Oil Revenue, yet still have to have record borrowing - and even that is not enough.
Or is it that the wars are sucking the UK dry.
Next he'll be wanting to impose Green Taxes - to provide funds to go fight a war.
Shows how incompetent Labour are at managing books, when they have a record windfall of Oil Revenue, yet still have to have record borrowing - and even that is not enough.
Or is it that the wars are sucking the UK dry.
Next he'll be wanting to impose Green Taxes - to provide funds to go fight a war.
Posted by: tris, scotland on 1:02am Sat 19 Jul 08
It's frightening the mess that they have got us into....
... then you think Norway.... Iceland... Denmark......
... then you weep and remember that you are part of this stupid united kingdom, so far up its own backside.
Do you remember Brown off to Europe to tell them all that if they only followed his model, everything would be fabulous...
Stupid useless waste of DNA.
It's frightening the mess that they have got us into....
... then you think Norway.... Iceland... Denmark......
... then you weep and remember that you are part of this stupid united kingdom, so far up its own backside.
Do you remember Brown off to Europe to tell them all that if they only followed his model, everything would be fabulous...
Stupid useless waste of DNA.
Posted by: Alan Hogg, Ayrshire on 2:59am Sat 19 Jul 08
To those of few with too few years to remember, the RULE is vote labour and eventually they'll feck the economy. Happens every time!
To those of few with too few years to remember, the RULE is vote labour and eventually they'll feck the economy. Happens every time!
Posted by: willie mac, Arden on 6:21am Sat 19 Jul 08
Well done Mr Fraser for your road to Damascus conversion on allowing comment.
You may not have liked comment, but commenting does form part of free speech, and we restrict that at our peril.
Dimwoodie was however at it yesterday restricting comment on leadpolitical articles. so the bias and censorship is still about.
Well done Mr Fraser for your road to Damascus conversion on allowing comment.
You may not have liked comment, but commenting does form part of free speech, and we restrict that at our peril.
Dimwoodie was however at it yesterday restricting comment on leadpolitical articles. so the bias and censorship is still about.
Posted by: willie mac, Arden on 6:30am Sat 19 Jul 08
Here are some Dimwoodie quotes from one of his articles today -
[bold][italic]Ms Curran, so media savvy that she was nicknamed the Minister for Newsnight, has more top-flight political experience than all of the other eight candidates put together
Ms Curran is a seasoned operator, speaks the language of the area, and exemplifies a gallus, fast-talking energy that will probably carry her through to victory next week[/italic][/bold] .
Could one be forgiven for thinking that Dimwoodie has a thing for Mags Curran or maybe has he just been telt what to say.
Objective, impartial journalism in the run up to Thursdays election.
I think not.
Here are some Dimwoodie quotes from one of his articles today -
Ms Curran, so media savvy that she was nicknamed the Minister for Newsnight, has more top-flight political experience than all of the other eight candidates put together
Ms Curran is a seasoned operator, speaks the language of the area, and exemplifies a gallus, fast-talking energy that will probably carry her through to victory next week .
Could one be forgiven for thinking that Dimwoodie has a thing for Mags Curran or maybe has he just been telt what to say.
Objective, impartial journalism in the run up to Thursdays election.
I think not.
Posted by: Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 8:26am Sat 19 Jul 08
Not much point having rules if you can't stick to them.
Comrade Broon's legacy.
1. Worst Chancellor in living memory
2. Worst Prime Minister in living memory
3. Last Scottish Prime Minister of UK ever.
4. Last New Labour Sleaze Prime Minister ever.
5. First Prime Minister to be sectioned under the Mental Health Act.
What goes around, comes around
Not much point having rules if you can't stick to them.
Comrade Broon's legacy.
1. Worst Chancellor in living memory
2. Worst Prime Minister in living memory
3. Last Scottish Prime Minister of UK ever.
4. Last New Labour Sleaze Prime Minister ever.
5. First Prime Minister to be sectioned under the Mental Health Act.
What goes around, comes around
Posted by: Donald Anderson, glasgow on 9:27am Sat 19 Jul 08
Faser breaks Labour rule on censorship.
Faser breaks Labour rule on censorship.
Posted by: soloman, Stirling on 10:14am Sat 19 Jul 08
John Sauven guardian.co.uk, Friday July 18, 2008
Nuclear power failure
Gordon Brown says the UK is at the forefront of a global 'nuclear renaissance'. But despite all the rhetoric, the real picture is grim.
Just this week Prime Minister Gordon Brown confidently assured us that the UK was at the forefront of a global "nuclear renaissance" and that within a few years we'd be home to at least eight bright, shining new reactors. We're told a week is a long time in politics, but it must seem an absolute eternity to the ever more bedraggled British nuclear industry.
Yesterday the Nuclear Decommissioning Authority (NDA) published its annual report and the predictable news was that the cost of decommissioning existing reactors and dealing with our legacy of radioactive waste has rocketed yet again. The bill now stands at a whopping £73bn, up from £53bn in 2006. That's an increase equivalent to the entire cost of the London 2012 Olympics each year.
Some experts believe that the real total might be more than £85bn. This is a staggering amount of taxpayers' money. Just to put the figure into context, it's about the same cost as the entire Apollo Programme that took man to the moon. Sadly, unlike JFK's lunar mission, in this case we have nothing to celebrate. What that money buys us is merely desperate grappling with the radioactive and toxic legacy of nuclear power.
The NDA claims the overall figure will be kept down because it will generate revenue through its commercial operations. But the idea that the NDA's commercial operations can guarantee this income is laughable. A big slice of the revenue they want to rely on for a century or more depends on two of the biggest white elephants in nuclear industry history – Thorp and the Sellafield Mox Plant. The Thorp reprocessing facility was shut for years following dangerous radioactive leaks and is now closed until Christmas while a new evaporator is fitted. Meanwhile it was recently announced to surprisingly little fanfare that the Mox plant, which cost nearly half a billion pounds, has produced next to nothing since it was built. Relying on these for a guaranteed income is like putting your faith in a sprig of flowers to ward of the plague.
The fact that the NDA is playing a central role in working out how much waste from new reactors might cost to dispose of should make all of us stop and think about the merits of any new nuclear programme. The taxpayer is picking up the tab for all these failures and cost increases now, and as the Public Accounts Committee stated recently, it is impossible to guarantee that the taxpayer will not pick up the tab for new nuclear power stations too. Government promises that there will be no subsides for its new nuclear programme are almost worthless.
Despite all the rhetoric and improbable promises about the benefits of new nuclear reactors, the real picture is grim. Much like the recent news that British Energy is paying twice as much to get two of its creaking UK reactors back on line (the bill is now more than £100m). And the rumours that French state-owned nuclear utility Electricite de France is having second thoughts about buying British Energy.
But before we conclude that this is a British malaise, this week brought the startling announcement from France that all its nuclear reactors must now be checked so that leaks of radioactive waste into local rivers, as happened at one site last week, don't happen anywhere else. This comes hot on the heels of the construction blunders at the new reactor site in Flamanville that led to the French nuclear authority suspending the project. These are the reactors and companies that are touted to deliver Brown's "nuclear renaissance", but unless stopped, the prospect is of a much more disastrous and expensive rerun.
A fall from the giddy heights of Brown's expansive nuclear dreams at the start of the week takes some beating. However, the one thing the nuclear industry really excels at is shooting itself in the foot. Which means we can probably expect more of the same before the summer's out.
So whos going to lend us this money, maybe the Iranians or North Koreans?
John Sauven guardian.co.uk, Friday July 18, 2008
Nuclear power failure
Gordon Brown says the UK is at the forefront of a global 'nuclear renaissance'. But despite all the rhetoric, the real picture is grim.
Just this week Prime Minister Gordon Brown confidently assured us that the UK was at the forefront of a global "nuclear renaissance" and that within a few years we'd be home to at least eight bright, shining new reactors. We're told a week is a long time in politics, but it must seem an absolute eternity to the ever more bedraggled British nuclear industry.
Yesterday the Nuclear Decommissioning Authority (NDA) published its annual report and the predictable news was that the cost of decommissioning existing reactors and dealing with our legacy of radioactive waste has rocketed yet again. The bill now stands at a whopping £73bn, up from £53bn in 2006. That's an increase equivalent to the entire cost of the London 2012 Olympics each year.
Some experts believe that the real total might be more than £85bn. This is a staggering amount of taxpayers' money. Just to put the figure into context, it's about the same cost as the entire Apollo Programme that took man to the moon. Sadly, unlike JFK's lunar mission, in this case we have nothing to celebrate. What that money buys us is merely desperate grappling with the radioactive and toxic legacy of nuclear power.
The NDA claims the overall figure will be kept down because it will generate revenue through its commercial operations. But the idea that the NDA's commercial operations can guarantee this income is laughable. A big slice of the revenue they want to rely on for a century or more depends on two of the biggest white elephants in nuclear industry history – Thorp and the Sellafield Mox Plant. The Thorp reprocessing facility was shut for years following dangerous radioactive leaks and is now closed until Christmas while a new evaporator is fitted. Meanwhile it was recently announced to surprisingly little fanfare that the Mox plant, which cost nearly half a billion pounds, has produced next to nothing since it was built. Relying on these for a guaranteed income is like putting your faith in a sprig of flowers to ward of the plague.
The fact that the NDA is playing a central role in working out how much waste from new reactors might cost to dispose of should make all of us stop and think about the merits of any new nuclear programme. The taxpayer is picking up the tab for all these failures and cost increases now, and as the Public Accounts Committee stated recently, it is impossible to guarantee that the taxpayer will not pick up the tab for new nuclear power stations too. Government promises that there will be no subsides for its new nuclear programme are almost worthless.
Despite all the rhetoric and improbable promises about the benefits of new nuclear reactors, the real picture is grim. Much like the recent news that British Energy is paying twice as much to get two of its creaking UK reactors back on line (the bill is now more than £100m). And the rumours that French state-owned nuclear utility Electricite de France is having second thoughts about buying British Energy.
But before we conclude that this is a British malaise, this week brought the startling announcement from France that all its nuclear reactors must now be checked so that leaks of radioactive waste into local rivers, as happened at one site last week, don't happen anywhere else. This comes hot on the heels of the construction blunders at the new reactor site in Flamanville that led to the French nuclear authority suspending the project. These are the reactors and companies that are touted to deliver Brown's "nuclear renaissance", but unless stopped, the prospect is of a much more disastrous and expensive rerun.
A fall from the giddy heights of Brown's expansive nuclear dreams at the start of the week takes some beating. However, the one thing the nuclear industry really excels at is shooting itself in the foot. Which means we can probably expect more of the same before the summer's out.
So whos going to lend us this money, maybe the Iranians or North Koreans?
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 10:37am Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote][bold]The Judge[/bold] wrote:
Unionists you have got to admit I am fair.
I did not even mention the PFI/PPP con that is going to cost us all a fortune and is not even on the books and therefore is not even counted in the golden rule calculations...yet we will be paying for years to come![/quote]
Not one comment from any unionist or labour supporter.
There is no defence of the indefensible
The Judge wrote:
Unionists you have got to admit I am fair.
I did not even mention the PFI/PPP con that is going to cost us all a fortune and is not even on the books and therefore is not even counted in the golden rule calculations...yet we will be paying for years to come!
Not one comment from any unionist or labour supporter.
There is no defence of the indefensible
Posted by: Supershug, Eaglesham on 11:08am Sat 19 Jul 08
Could the lifting of the Douglas Fraser comments embargo and the resignation of The Herald editor be connected?
As a reflection of reader satisfaction, the comments in recent months could hardly be seen as a ringing endorsement.
Could the lifting of the Douglas Fraser comments embargo and the resignation of The Herald editor be connected?
As a reflection of reader satisfaction, the comments in recent months could hardly be seen as a ringing endorsement.
Posted by: Vote for Scotlands Future, Vote for the SNP on 11:15am Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote]Stupid useless waste of DNA.[/quote] He's also an Oxygen Stealer.
Stupid useless waste of DNA.
He's also an Oxygen Stealer.
Posted by: Vote for Scotlands Future, Vote for the SNP on 11:25am Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote]Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 8:26am today
Not much point having rules if you can't stick to them. [/quote] Of course there is. The Laws are for ordinary people - not the Royal Elite of Labour. You need to be sent for re-education. You conditioning is obviously slipping as you are questioning the actions of our Beloved Leader.
You should be like Curran who will vote for and support Brown regardless.
Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 8:26am today
Not much point having rules if you can't stick to them.
Of course there is. The Laws are for ordinary people - not the Royal Elite of Labour. You need to be sent for re-education. You conditioning is obviously slipping as you are questioning the actions of our Beloved Leader.
You should be like Curran who will vote for and support Brown regardless.
Posted by: Mac, Dundee on 11:43am Sat 19 Jul 08
There will be a £120 billion shortfall in UK government spending this year. That is the extent of the BLACK-HOLE facing Gordon Brown and Alistair Darling. In Arthur Midwinter speak that is £2000 for every man, woman, child in Scotland.
There will be a £120 billion shortfall in UK government spending this year. That is the extent of the BLACK-HOLE facing Gordon Brown and Alistair Darling. In Arthur Midwinter speak that is £2000 for every man, woman, child in Scotland.
Posted by: soloman, Stirling on 11:44am Sat 19 Jul 08
Fantasy Football:
It has been reported that there has been a drop in the up-take of people getting involved with Fantasy Football, however the report went on to state that there was now a new alternative being born out of London, called Fantasy Economics, the first contestants have made a total sham of things so if you want to get involved you could win the big prize!
This competition is particularly suited to those with a big ego and who are self opinionated and who will not listen to critiscism or reason. Probably a control freak, if you've ever worked in theatre perhaps a puppet theatre then you could be quids in.
or if you're REALLY LUCKY and live in BONNIE SCOTLAND then you can always VOTE SNP the only alternative.
Fantasy Football:
It has been reported that there has been a drop in the up-take of people getting involved with Fantasy Football, however the report went on to state that there was now a new alternative being born out of London, called Fantasy Economics, the first contestants have made a total sham of things so if you want to get involved you could win the big prize!
This competition is particularly suited to those with a big ego and who are self opinionated and who will not listen to critiscism or reason. Probably a control freak, if you've ever worked in theatre perhaps a puppet theatre then you could be quids in.
or if you're REALLY LUCKY and live in BONNIE SCOTLAND then you can always VOTE SNP the only alternative.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 12:21pm Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote]
I'm beginning to think the only thing in Downing St with a spine is his book on courage......
[bold]David Cameron MP[/bold]
[/quote]
I'm beginning to think the only thing in Downing St with a spine is his book on courage......
David Cameron MP
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 12:28pm Sat 19 Jul 08
[bold]Colabourtives Policy on Incapacity Benefit[/bold]
One wonders whether Purnell has 'leaked' this in an effort to destabilise Brown during his visit to Iraq....
How will this play in Glasgow East with less than week to go to polling day....
Blairites putting the last knife in?
Colabourtives Policy on Incapacity Benefit
One wonders whether Purnell has 'leaked' this in an effort to destabilise Brown during his visit to Iraq....
How will this play in Glasgow East with less than week to go to polling day....
Blairites putting the last knife in?
Posted by: DiJit, glasgow on 12:42pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Borrowing is the root cause of the UK's problems.
The very best increasing borrowing can do is defer the day of reckoning.
Brown/Darling need to understand that the meaning of the word 'Budget' is to balance income with expenditure. Borrowing is not income.
More borrowing will simply depress the value of the pound which will increase the cost of all imports hence fueling inflation.
The answer is to cut spending. Do it now, do it hard and fast. Yes it will hurt but better now than in the future.
Apparently the UK has borrowed £18k per citizen.
Do not increase it.
Give us the promised cull of civil servants.
Scrap aircraft carriers at a cost of £4bn.
Make the London Olympics self funding in the main and don't make the mistake of assuming it needs to be flash and glitzy.
Remember, less is more.
Now taxation & fuel costs.
With petrol around £1.20/litre the tax per litre has probably nearly doubled. The Vat element alone was 12p when fuel was 0.80p/litre. Now at £1.20p/litre the Vat has soared by 50% to 18p/litre.
Stop begging for oil producers to increase production in the hope oil will fall. Simply cut the taxes on fuel. That will immediately feed through to lower inflation as oil for transport adds to the cost of everything. Further it will help depress wage increase demands.
Borrowing is the root cause of the UK's problems.
The very best increasing borrowing can do is defer the day of reckoning.
Brown/Darling need to understand that the meaning of the word 'Budget' is to balance income with expenditure. Borrowing is not income.
More borrowing will simply depress the value of the pound which will increase the cost of all imports hence fueling inflation.
The answer is to cut spending. Do it now, do it hard and fast. Yes it will hurt but better now than in the future.
Apparently the UK has borrowed £18k per citizen.
Do not increase it.
Give us the promised cull of civil servants.
Scrap aircraft carriers at a cost of £4bn.
Make the London Olympics self funding in the main and don't make the mistake of assuming it needs to be flash and glitzy.
Remember, less is more.
Now taxation & fuel costs.
With petrol around £1.20/litre the tax per litre has probably nearly doubled. The Vat element alone was 12p when fuel was 0.80p/litre. Now at £1.20p/litre the Vat has soared by 50% to 18p/litre.
Stop begging for oil producers to increase production in the hope oil will fall. Simply cut the taxes on fuel. That will immediately feed through to lower inflation as oil for transport adds to the cost of everything. Further it will help depress wage increase demands.
Posted by: Iainbroch, Moray on 1:09pm Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote][bold]Wardog[/bold] wrote:
[bold]Colabourtives Policy on Incapacity Benefit[/bold] One wonders whether Purnell has 'leaked' this in an effort to destabilise Brown during his visit to Iraq.... How will this play in Glasgow East with less than week to go to polling day.... Blairites putting the last knife in? [/quote] Wounded squaddies to be hounded by Broonies benefit spies! Not the headlines we will get though!
Wardog wrote:
Colabourtives Policy on Incapacity Benefit One wonders whether Purnell has 'leaked' this in an effort to destabilise Brown during his visit to Iraq.... How will this play in Glasgow East with less than week to go to polling day.... Blairites putting the last knife in?
Wounded squaddies to be hounded by Broonies benefit spies! Not the headlines we will get though!
Posted by: Cuthulan, approx.12,000 miles from Earths core on 1:22pm Sat 19 Jul 08
All the unionists that say Scotland is a non viable state because it cannot survive economically ,well now we know the UK is a non-viable independant state even by labours economic standards.When are the economic unionists going to call for Westminster to be disbanded and to give our soverignty to a union with Brussels and become the BIGGEST economic force on the planet!?We have been through the BOOM times and look how much Prudence Brown has managed to put away . NOTHING!!Our Norwegian neighbours are sitting on nearly half a TRILLION rainy day OIL fund !
Brown sold our GOLD , at rock bottom prices ,so we cannot benefit from the rise in gold prices.
THe UK banks have a "special relationship" with the USA encouraged by Brown
Unfortunately the USA is $53 TRILLION in debt
http://www.sfgate.co
m/cgi-bin/article.cg
i?f=/c/a/2008/07/17/
MN8Q11OT2M.DTL&tsp=1
That's $455,000 per US taxpayer and with the openning of the Irainian Oil Bourse which primeraly sells oil in EURO's, the petrodollars days are over.
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Iranian_oil
_bourse
The dollar will continue to fall and the British finacial economy with it. This is the REAL reason for sanctions against Iran , but do not expect your government,the Scotsman or the BBC to tell you! They will keep lying about non-existant WMD's ,just like Iraq ,which was the first country to sell OIL in EUROS ,coincidence?!?!
http://www.un.org/de
pts/oip/background/o
ilexports.html
The simple FACT is Scotland makes money ,the UK does NOT!!!.UK lost 34 BILLION in 2006 and this was in the BOOM times !!But us Scots my not have noticed those Boom times.Here come the hard times and the BEST and ONLY way for Scotland to survive this is to be independant!!
Sorry if I wondered a bit off topic in the middle.
All the unionists that say Scotland is a non viable state because it cannot survive economically ,well now we know the UK is a non-viable independant state even by labours economic standards.When are the economic unionists going to call for Westminster to be disbanded and to give our soverignty to a union with Brussels and become the BIGGEST economic force on the planet!?We have been through the BOOM times and look how much Prudence Brown has managed to put away . NOTHING!!Our Norwegian neighbours are sitting on nearly half a TRILLION rainy day OIL fund !
Brown sold our GOLD , at rock bottom prices ,so we cannot benefit from the rise in gold prices.
THe UK banks have a "special relationship" with the USA encouraged by Brown
Unfortunately the USA is $53 TRILLION in debt
http://www.sfgate.co
m/cgi-bin/article.cg
i?f=/c/a/2008/07/17/
MN8Q11OT2M.DTL&tsp=1
That's $455,000 per US taxpayer and with the openning of the Irainian Oil Bourse which primeraly sells oil in EURO's, the petrodollars days are over.
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Iranian_oil
_bourse
The dollar will continue to fall and the British finacial economy with it. This is the REAL reason for sanctions against Iran , but do not expect your government,the Scotsman or the BBC to tell you! They will keep lying about non-existant WMD's ,just like Iraq ,which was the first country to sell OIL in EUROS ,coincidence?!?!
http://www.un.org/de
pts/oip/background/o
ilexports.html
The simple FACT is Scotland makes money ,the UK does NOT!!!.UK lost 34 BILLION in 2006 and this was in the BOOM times !!But us Scots my not have noticed those Boom times.Here come the hard times and the BEST and ONLY way for Scotland to survive this is to be independant!!
Sorry if I wondered a bit off topic in the middle.
Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 1:30pm Sat 19 Jul 08
I have to laugh , so many comments in the papers today expressing "shock" that the former "Iron Chancellor" may have to break one of his rules on borrowing. How so as he has done it in the past. He has previous for moving the goalposts yet all the sycophants said nothing about the emperor having no clothes on those occassions !!!!
He ran the economy like a bad household budget. Selling off what he could to finance a life on the never never and hey ho when it goes wrong he has nothing left for a rainy day. Old Mother Broon !
I also laughed at press releases yesterday proclaiming that the "Tide has turned which suggested multitudeds of voters were returning to the Labour fold. Who is in charge of the Labour PR team ? Comical Ali ? Comical Mags more like !
I have to laugh , so many comments in the papers today expressing "shock" that the former "Iron Chancellor" may have to break one of his rules on borrowing. How so as he has done it in the past. He has previous for moving the goalposts yet all the sycophants said nothing about the emperor having no clothes on those occassions !!!!
He ran the economy like a bad household budget. Selling off what he could to finance a life on the never never and hey ho when it goes wrong he has nothing left for a rainy day. Old Mother Broon !
I also laughed at press releases yesterday proclaiming that the "Tide has turned which suggested multitudeds of voters were returning to the Labour fold. Who is in charge of the Labour PR team ? Comical Ali ? Comical Mags more like !
Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 1:34pm Sat 19 Jul 08
To be fair to our Politicians they need not concern themselves with things like budgets in their own lives. If they fall short hey just write an expense chitty to take care of any shortfall and call it "Staff" expenditure and sundries. Its brilliant for getting you through a five week month : )
To be fair to our Politicians they need not concern themselves with things like budgets in their own lives. If they fall short hey just write an expense chitty to take care of any shortfall and call it "Staff" expenditure and sundries. Its brilliant for getting you through a five week month : )
Posted by: Proximaking, Dundee, UK on 1:56pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Surely the problem is they have created millions of non-jobs. Someone driving a bus during the day that is empty is not only in a non-job they are wasting fuel and polluting the planet at the same time. Someone who is a "teacher" who can't even get a class of 16 year olds to read after 11 years in their charge and blames everyone else for their "profession's" failure is in a non-job. Scientists who demand billions to look at galaxies billions of light years away when they still haven't explained Michelson and Morley's [italic]non-null[/italic] result from over one hundred years ago confirmed in spades by Dayton Miller, Laithwaite from over 30 year ago, Pons and Fleishman from 20 years ago (Pooh poohed then confirmed even at Los Alamos now), Tesla's evanescent sourced car driven by stable sun storms (as in Jupiters red spot) from 70 years ago, bees flying around the garden who flap their wings 16% LESS when the air gets 20 DegC warmer and so less dense, from 600million years ago, a child's spinning top from 3,000 years ago .... are in non-jobs. ALL of these sorts of non-jobs should be got rid of. This government spends £100billion EVERY year on quangos as well, quangos that produce precisely nothing, that is even more than they spend on the horrendously inefficient health service run by doctors for doctors. Until taxes are slashed to one tenth of their present levels I simply won't believe I'm getting value for money from "public services" because they are only worth one tenth of what we pay and that is the real scandal we should be discussing.
Surely the problem is they have created millions of non-jobs. Someone driving a bus during the day that is empty is not only in a non-job they are wasting fuel and polluting the planet at the same time. Someone who is a "teacher" who can't even get a class of 16 year olds to read after 11 years in their charge and blames everyone else for their "profession's" failure is in a non-job. Scientists who demand billions to look at galaxies billions of light years away when they still haven't explained Michelson and Morley's
non-null result from over one hundred years ago confirmed in spades by Dayton Miller, Laithwaite from over 30 year ago, Pons and Fleishman from 20 years ago (Pooh poohed then confirmed even at Los Alamos now), Tesla's evanescent sourced car driven by stable sun storms (as in Jupiters red spot) from 70 years ago, bees flying around the garden who flap their wings 16% LESS when the air gets 20 DegC warmer and so less dense, from 600million years ago, a child's spinning top from 3,000 years ago .... are in non-jobs. ALL of these sorts of non-jobs should be got rid of. This government spends £100billion EVERY year on quangos as well, quangos that produce precisely nothing, that is even more than they spend on the horrendously inefficient health service run by doctors for doctors. Until taxes are slashed to one tenth of their present levels I simply won't believe I'm getting value for money from "public services" because they are only worth one tenth of what we pay and that is the real scandal we should be discussing.
Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 1:57pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Unconfirmed reports have it that Old Mother Broon is in talks with Bill Gates in order to Develop a new edition of "Microsoft Money...the Iron Chancellor edition"... There are a number of variations on the normal edition as used by every day folks like you and me. For example the whole budget is prepared against the backdrop "Low interest rates are the opium of the people."
To start you first of all you make a big show of apparently giving independence to the Bank of England in the setting of said interest rates, In reality you install a puppet to do your bidding whom you can blame if things go wrong. As a consequence you must take measures to artificially keep interest rates low to create the impression that we've never had it so good( on plastic). Such measures may include pumping large amounts of money into the economy funded by raids on Pension funds, stealth taxes, Green Taxes, selling off the family silver etc etc This will work for a while but when these funds dry up then what? Well how about changing the way we measure inflation to exclude unimportant stuff such as House Prices, Fuel,and energy costs and other extraneous items like food. Are you still with me ? What do you think of the show so far ? Good game good game...anyway as the Romans discovered nothing keeps the citizens happy whilst the Empire collapses around their ears like bread and circuses so encourage the media to go overboard on "Celebrity Culture" not your normal celebs of course but complete z Listers whos life you seek escape in ( by the way Bex must go ). Yes even papers like the Daily Mail have reams and reams of celebrity items for us to eat cake to.
When all that fails and you can always go to China cap in hand and drum up some business ! Rant over !
Unconfirmed reports have it that Old Mother Broon is in talks with Bill Gates in order to Develop a new edition of "Microsoft Money...the Iron Chancellor edition"... There are a number of variations on the normal edition as used by every day folks like you and me. For example the whole budget is prepared against the backdrop "Low interest rates are the opium of the people."
To start you first of all you make a big show of apparently giving independence to the Bank of England in the setting of said interest rates, In reality you install a puppet to do your bidding whom you can blame if things go wrong. As a consequence you must take measures to artificially keep interest rates low to create the impression that we've never had it so good( on plastic). Such measures may include pumping large amounts of money into the economy funded by raids on Pension funds, stealth taxes, Green Taxes, selling off the family silver etc etc This will work for a while but when these funds dry up then what? Well how about changing the way we measure inflation to exclude unimportant stuff such as House Prices, Fuel,and energy costs and other extraneous items like food. Are you still with me ? What do you think of the show so far ? Good game good game...anyway as the Romans discovered nothing keeps the citizens happy whilst the Empire collapses around their ears like bread and circuses so encourage the media to go overboard on "Celebrity Culture" not your normal celebs of course but complete z Listers whos life you seek escape in ( by the way Bex must go ). Yes even papers like the Daily Mail have reams and reams of celebrity items for us to eat cake to.
When all that fails and you can always go to China cap in hand and drum up some business ! Rant over !
Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 2:08pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Proximaking Im curious about your statements on the Michelson Morley ether experiments. Can you provide source materials on these assertions ? Web links etc
Sorry folks this subject is not entirley unconnected as it concerns the scientific principle that nothing travels faster than light. If we could then maybe we could go back in time and shout "The emperors got no clothes on" when nu Labour come to power and thus save us all from our current predicament. Hold on .....some of us did and it made no difference !!!!!!
Proximaking Im curious about your statements on the Michelson Morley ether experiments. Can you provide source materials on these assertions ? Web links etc
Sorry folks this subject is not entirley unconnected as it concerns the scientific principle that nothing travels faster than light. If we could then maybe we could go back in time and shout "The emperors got no clothes on" when nu Labour come to power and thus save us all from our current predicament. Hold on .....some of us did and it made no difference !!!!!!
Posted by: ditchgazza on 2:09pm Sat 19 Jul 08
I agree with proximaking about getting rid of non jobs, inclucing councillors from Troon.
I agree with proximaking about getting rid of non jobs, inclucing councillors from Troon.
Posted by: ditchgazza on 2:10pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Sorry, Largs.
Posted by: Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 2:18pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Comrade Broon's political career is all but over. Regardless what happens on Thursday he'll hang onto power, hoping against hope that things will improve. They won't.
No one will challenge his leadership. Who would want the prize of taking over a party that's sure to be annihilated at the next election.
No, his only hope is a terrorist(s) outrage so he can declare Marshall Law and run the country with the military helping him.
Don't laugh - I wouldn't put it past this nutter.
Lets help him on his way.
[bold]Vote SNP.
The ONLY party for ALL the people of Scotland[/bold]
Comrade Broon's political career is all but over. Regardless what happens on Thursday he'll hang onto power, hoping against hope that things will improve. They won't.
No one will challenge his leadership. Who would want the prize of taking over a party that's sure to be annihilated at the next election.
No, his only hope is a terrorist(s) outrage so he can declare Marshall Law and run the country with the military helping him.
Don't laugh - I wouldn't put it past this nutter.
Lets help him on his way.
Vote SNP.
The ONLY party for ALL the people of Scotland Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 2:33pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Jimmy the Pie I agree, any wanna be leader of the Labour Party who has any sense will not want to take over at the bridge as the ship is sinking.
Since you mention terrorist incidents can anyone explain to me why the failed incidents in London and Glasgow last summer are used as evidence that Broon made an impressive start as PM?
What exactly did he do to foil these attacks ?
Jimmy the Pie I agree, any wanna be leader of the Labour Party who has any sense will not want to take over at the bridge as the ship is sinking.
Since you mention terrorist incidents can anyone explain to me why the failed incidents in London and Glasgow last summer are used as evidence that Broon made an impressive start as PM?
What exactly did he do to foil these attacks ?
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 2:48pm Sat 19 Jul 08
[quote][bold]elrond511[/bold] wrote:
Jimmy the Pie I agree, any wanna be leader of the Labour Party who has any sense will not want to take over at the bridge as the ship is sinking.
Since you mention terrorist incidents can anyone explain to me why the failed incidents in London and Glasgow last summer are used as evidence that Broon made an impressive start as PM?
What exactly did he do to foil these attacks ?
[/quote] It was merely the high water mark of Brown shamelessly according himself credit for every local, global and fortuitous event that came his way.
These days ... ??? [bold]Hubris ![/bold]
elrond511 wrote:
Jimmy the Pie I agree, any wanna be leader of the Labour Party who has any sense will not want to take over at the bridge as the ship is sinking.
Since you mention terrorist incidents can anyone explain to me why the failed incidents in London and Glasgow last summer are used as evidence that Broon made an impressive start as PM?
What exactly did he do to foil these attacks ?
It was merely the high water mark of Brown shamelessly according himself credit for every local, global and fortuitous event that came his way.
These days ... ???
Hubris ! Posted by: Faux Cu, Palais Bourbon on 3:55pm Sat 19 Jul 08
From Todays Tomeonline re Pakistan Riots over fall in sgare prices and impoverishment of many Pakistanis
[quote]
Investors ransacked stock exchanges in Karachi, Lahore and Islamabad yesterday, reacting to a share-price rout that has devastated the life savings of many Pakistanis.
Police and paramilitary officers were drafted in to protect the Karachi Stock Exchange after a mob stoned the building and smashed windows. In Lahore, investors burnt tyres and blockaded the local bourse.
The violence came after a 35 per cent fall in the Karachi index in the past three months on concerns over the stability of Pakistan's fragile coalition Government, soaring inflation, and the weakness of the rupee.
Fears over growing lawlessness in northern Pakistan and the threat of United States military attacks in tribal regions have also contributed to an exodus of foreign investors that has helped to wipe more than £15 billion from the value of Pakistan shares since April.[/quote]
I wonder if the good folks of Glasgow East could do the same to Labour Party H Q as they have suffered the same fate, albeit iver the last 8 / 11/ 50+ years of Labour pigs in the trough politics?
From Todays Tomeonline re Pakistan Riots over fall in sgare prices and impoverishment of many Pakistanis
Investors ransacked stock exchanges in Karachi, Lahore and Islamabad yesterday, reacting to a share-price rout that has devastated the life savings of many Pakistanis.
Police and paramilitary officers were drafted in to protect the Karachi Stock Exchange after a mob stoned the building and smashed windows. In Lahore, investors burnt tyres and blockaded the local bourse.
The violence came after a 35 per cent fall in the Karachi index in the past three months on concerns over the stability of Pakistan's fragile coalition Government, soaring inflation, and the weakness of the rupee.
Fears over growing lawlessness in northern Pakistan and the threat of United States military attacks in tribal regions have also contributed to an exodus of foreign investors that has helped to wipe more than £15 billion from the value of Pakistan shares since April.
I wonder if the good folks of Glasgow East could do the same to Labour Party H Q as they have suffered the same fate, albeit iver the last 8 / 11/ 50+ years of Labour pigs in the trough politics?
Posted by: Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 4:57pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Any further updates on New Labour Sleaze and Corruption's retired serial swindler David Marshall???
[bold]Remember the words from Faither Cairns
"I would ask the media to give David (Marshall) and his family some privacy as he is suffering ill health"
Aye right - Maybe repetitive strain injury from continually counting his ill gotten gains???[/bold]
Any further updates on New Labour Sleaze and Corruption's retired serial swindler David Marshall???
Remember the words from Faither Cairns
"I would ask the media to give David (Marshall) and his family some privacy as he is suffering ill health"
Aye right - Maybe repetitive strain injury from continually counting his ill gotten gains??? Posted by: ditchgazza on 6:18pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Heavy things these ingots, jimmy.
Heavy things these ingots, jimmy.
Posted by: Jimbo on 6:30pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Anyone know the exact figures of the UK income?
I thought the the UK's national income was said to be £600 billion plus. If that is the case then Darling and Brown are being a bit reluctant with their honesty.
If they've already borrowed up to 40% of the national income (and still not finished) then their black hole must be in excess of £200 billion.
Yes? No? Anyone?
Anyone know the exact figures of the UK income?
I thought the the UK's national income was said to be £600 billion plus. If that is the case then Darling and Brown are being a bit reluctant with their honesty.
If they've already borrowed up to 40% of the national income (and still not finished) then their black hole must be in excess of £200 billion.
Yes? No? Anyone?
Posted by: Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 6:42pm Sat 19 Jul 08
[bold]REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR.
1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis.
2. Wasted billions on illegal wars.
3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold.
4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock.
5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh
ters.
6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices.
7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies.
8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt.
9. Leaving the country billions in debt.
10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice.
11. Cash for honours.
12. Illegal ‘donations’
13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption.
14. Millennium Dome
15. London Olympics
16. No European referendum as promised.
17. ID cards.
18. NHS computerisation shambles
19. Child tax credit shambles.
20. Child Support Agency shambles
21. Scottish Election shambles
22. Britishness Day???
23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut.
24. Means testing benefits for the old.
25. Non Dom Tax Exiles given favourable tax treatment.
26. Pension fund theft.
27. Equitable Life shambles
28. Continued Theft of Scottish Oil & Gas
29. Destruction of Scottish Fishing Industry
30. Massive election frauds in Birmingham and other places (judge described as being like "banana republic" corruption)[/bold]
Reason for voting for New Labour??
[italic]AM2 says it will save the UNION and the QUEEN.[/italic]
REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR.
1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis.
2. Wasted billions on illegal wars.
3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold.
4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock.
5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh
ters.
6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices.
7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies.
8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt.
9. Leaving the country billions in debt.
10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice.
11. Cash for honours.
12. Illegal ‘donations’
13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption.
14. Millennium Dome
15. London Olympics
16. No European referendum as promised.
17. ID cards.
18. NHS computerisation shambles
19. Child tax credit shambles.
20. Child Support Agency shambles
21. Scottish Election shambles
22. Britishness Day???
23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut.
24. Means testing benefits for the old.
25. Non Dom Tax Exiles given favourable tax treatment.
26. Pension fund theft.
27. Equitable Life shambles
28. Continued Theft of Scottish Oil & Gas
29. Destruction of Scottish Fishing Industry
30. Massive election frauds in Birmingham and other places (judge described as being like "banana republic" corruption)
Reason for voting for New Labour??
AM2 says it will save the UNION and the QUEEN. Posted by: willie mac, Arden on 10:38pm Sat 19 Jul 08
Jimmie thye Pie,
Messrs Browne, Cairn and Harris tell us that we have never had it so good.
Something doesn't gel!
Jimmie thye Pie,
Messrs Browne, Cairn and Harris tell us that we have never had it so good.
Something doesn't gel!
Posted by: elrond511, glasgow on 12:36am Sun 20 Jul 08
**** me no further comments I smell **** i SMELL CENSHORSHIP
**** me no further comments I smell **** i SMELL CENSHORSHIP
Posted by: jonny bond, glasgow on 3:07pm Sun 20 Jul 08
Oh Dear the batphone was obviously ringing at number 11 last night and gordon the cloon broon was in flashback hell as he had the same conversation from the opposite end of the phone he used to have with the guy he called an economic muppet. It went something like this on both occasions only this time Gordon took the PMs position of the conversation.
Trembling Tony
Gordy me old pal me old mate we need some more money for this darn war on terror we are not doing too well and nearly as well as you budgeted for.
GB as Chancellor
As you know tony as I've explained to you many times our limit of borrowing is set as a percentage of gdp and that is doing nicely so we may in the future be able to afford those vests you are so keen on but the idea of going above the 40% ceiling well its just not cricket old bean.
Oh Dear the batphone was obviously ringing at number 11 last night and gordon the cloon broon was in flashback hell as he had the same conversation from the opposite end of the phone he used to have with the guy he called an economic muppet. It went something like this on both occasions only this time Gordon took the PMs position of the conversation.
Trembling Tony
Gordy me old pal me old mate we need some more money for this darn war on terror we are not doing too well and nearly as well as you budgeted for.
GB as Chancellor
As you know tony as I've explained to you many times our limit of borrowing is set as a percentage of gdp and that is doing nicely so we may in the future be able to afford those vests you are so keen on but the idea of going above the 40% ceiling well its just not cricket old bean.
Posted by: Iainbroch, Moray on 12:14am Mon 21 Jul 08
[quote][bold]Jimmy the Pie[/bold] wrote:
[bold]REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR. 1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis. 2. Wasted billions on illegal wars. 3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold. 4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock. 5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh ters. 6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices. 7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies. 8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt. 9. Leaving the country billions in debt. 10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice. 11. Cash for honours. 12. Illegal ‘donations’ 13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption. 14. Millennium Dome 15. London Olympics 16. No European referendum as promised. 17. ID cards. 18. NHS computerisation shambles 19. Child tax credit shambles. 20. Child Support Agency shambles 21. Scottish Election shambles 22. Britishness Day??? 23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut. 24. Means testing benefits for the old. 25. Non Dom Tax Exiles given favourable tax treatment. 26. Pension fund theft. 27. Equitable Life shambles 28. Continued Theft of Scottish Oil & Gas 29. Destruction of Scottish Fishing Industry 30. Massive election frauds in Birmingham and other places (judge described as being like "banana republic" corruption)[/bold] Reason for voting for New Labour?? [italic]AM2 says it will save the UNION and the QUEEN.[/italic] [/quote] You can always take Broonies Happy Pill and everything will be alright in Broonie Paradise and you will see the light and not get depressed anymore! The truth deilvered to you in Liebaahs new back to work happieness pill!
Of course if you are already in work, a sigle parent or a carer Or severly disabled then you will not get a prescription for the New Happy Pill!
Jimmy the Pie wrote:
REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR. 1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis. 2. Wasted billions on illegal wars. 3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold. 4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock. 5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh ters. 6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices. 7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies. 8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt. 9. Leaving the country billions in debt. 10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice. 11. Cash for honours. 12. Illegal ‘donations’ 13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption. 14. Millennium Dome 15. London Olympics 16. No European referendum as promised. 17. ID cards. 18. NHS computerisation shambles 19. Child tax credit shambles. 20. Child Support Agency shambles 21. Scottish Election shambles 22. Britishness Day??? 23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut. 24. Means testing benefits for the old. 25. Non Dom Tax Exiles given favourable tax treatment. 26. Pension fund theft. 27. Equitable Life shambles 28. Continued Theft of Scottish Oil & Gas 29. Destruction of Scottish Fishing Industry 30. Massive election frauds in Birmingham and other places (judge described as being like "banana republic" corruption) Reason for voting for New Labour?? AM2 says it will save the UNION and the QUEEN.
You can always take Broonies Happy Pill and everything will be alright in Broonie Paradise and you will see the light and not get depressed anymore! The truth deilvered to you in Liebaahs new back to work happieness pill!
Of course if you are already in work, a sigle parent or a carer Or severly disabled then you will not get a prescription for the New Happy Pill!
Posted by: Iainbroch, Moray on 12:16am Mon 21 Jul 08
[quote][bold]willie mac[/bold] wrote:
Jimmie thye Pie, Messrs Browne, Cairn and Harris tell us that we have never had it so good. Something doesn't gel![/quote] It is Liebaahs new back to work Happieness Pill!
willie mac wrote:
Jimmie thye Pie, Messrs Browne, Cairn and Harris tell us that we have never had it so good. Something doesn't gel!
It is Liebaahs new back to work Happieness Pill!
Posted by: baffled, scotland on 11:20am Mon 21 Jul 08
[quote][bold]Jimmy the Pie[/bold] wrote:
[bold]REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR.
1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis.
2. Wasted billions on illegal wars.
3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold.
4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock.
5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh
ters.
6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices.
7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies.
8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt.
9. Leaving the country billions in debt.
10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice.
11. Cash for honours.
12. Illegal ‘donations’
13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption.
14. Millennium Dome
15. London Olympics
16. No European referendum as promised.
17. ID cards.
18. NHS computerisation shambles
19. Child tax credit shambles.
20. Child Support Agency shambles
21. Scottish Election shambles
22. Britishness Day???
23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut.
24. Means testing benefits for the old.
25. Non Dom Tax Exiles given favourable tax treatment.
26. Pension fund theft.
27. Equitable Life shambles
28. Continued Theft of Scottish Oil & Gas
29. Destruction of Scottish Fishing Industry
30. Massive election frauds in Birmingham and other places (judge described as being like "banana republic" corruption)[/bold]
Reason for voting for New Labour??
[italic]AM2 says it will save the UNION and the QUEEN.[/italic] [/quote]
What was the SNP line on Nothern Rock?
Jimmy the Pie wrote:
REASON’S FOR NOT VOTING FOR NEW LABOUR.
1. Murder of thousands of innocent Iraqis.
2. Wasted billions on illegal wars.
3. Wasted billions on ‘fire sale’ of gold.
4. Wasted billions on Northern Rock.
5. Wasted billions on armaments, ie Trident/Chinook helicopters/Eurofigh
ters.
6. Leaving thousands in abject poverty due to high fuel prices.
7. Sending troops to fight illegal wars with inadequate supplies.
8. Leaving future generations with billions of PPP/PFI debt.
9. Leaving the country billions in debt.
10. Seriously underestimating immigrant numbers, despite contrary advice.
11. Cash for honours.
12. Illegal ‘donations’
13. Widespread New Labour Sleaze and Corruption, sleaze and corruption.
14. Millennium Dome
15. London Olympics
16. No European referendum as promised.
17. ID cards.
18. NHS computerisation shambles
19. Child tax credit shambles.
20. Child Support Agency shambles
21. Scottish Election shambles
22. Britishness Day???
23. Millionaire's inheritance tax cut
Politics
INDEX
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