Alexander: Cameron accuses Brown of losing control
Douglas Fraser: "A fifth day of Labour confusion"
David Cameron today accused Gordon Brown of losing control of the Scottish Labour Party after its leader, Wendy Alexander, broke with previous policy to call for a referendum on Scottish independence.
The Conservative leader's jibes were his opening salvo at Prime Minister's questions but came as the bid by Ms Alexander to seek an early referendum on independence were backed by a Labour MP.
Mr Brown made clear today that he was determined to fight on on Labour's record in Government despite its disastrous showing in the local elections in England and Wales.
With the crucial Crewe and Nantwich by-election looming, the Prime Minister suffered a further blow overnight with the publication of an opinion poll showing that 55% of Labour voters thought he should quit.
In his first Commons appearance since last week's town hall ballot results, he again sought to paint the Tories as the party of "slick salesmanship" with no substance to their policies.
But he was taunted by Conservative leader David Cameron, who dismissed his promise to listen as "empty words" and who derided his lack of "strong leadership".
Before the clash in the Commons Brian Donohoe, MP for Central Ayrshire, said he had long supported a referendum but was surprised by the way it was announced.
| The advantages are that it would give for once and for all a decision on whether or not the county wanted to separate from the UK | | Brian Donohoe MP |
|
The MP said he wanted a referendum "as soon as is possible."
"If it's possible to bring it forward, I would have that referendum tomorrow," said Mr Donohoe.
"I think the people of Scotland have to determine whether or not we allow the situation to bubble on or whether or not we lance it as an issue right now and get on with running the economy of the country, which I think the public believe is more important."
Mr Donohoe's backing, in an interview on BBC Radio Scotland's Good Morning Scotland, came after a meeting of Scottish MPs at Westminster last night.
In an about-turn on her previous stance, Ms Alexander has challenged SNP leader Alex Salmond to "put up or shut up".
She wants the SNP to bring forward its plans for an independence referendum bill, currently planned for 2010 - and has said Labour may bring forward its own bill.
Downing Street has described her stance as "a matter for her."
But Mr Donohoe said he and his constituency party had supported just such a move nine months ago.
"It's not something that's a surprise in that sense - it may be in terms of the way it's been announced," said the MP.
"I believe that the decision taken is a good one."
There had been a "quite general discussion" within the party in the past, and Mr Donohoe insisted that the important discussion at last night's meeting was on the economy.
His favoured wording for the referendum was a "straightforward" yes or no to independence.
Mr Donohoe insisted it had not been a "divisive" issue at last night's meeting.
"Obviously there were comments made that it would have been better to be involved in the consultation.
"But as an issue, I think it's one that has to be addressed at some point."
He went on: "The advantages are that it would give for once and for all a decision on whether or not the county wanted to separate from the UK, which has served Scotland extremely well."
And Mr Donohoe said there could be a case for a referendum launched from Westminster if one was not launched by Holyrood.
"I would think we have to listen to what the people are asking for," he said.
"What they are asking for is a bit of stability in politics," he said.
"If that's the way to get it then yes, I think that would be the way to overcome the problem."
He said last night's meeting came to no conclusions, as that was not its role.
"There will come a day when we have that discussion inside the group and we will have Wendy present to discuss the whole situation," he said.
© All rights reserved. Reproduction in whole or in part without
permission is prohibited.
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 2:52pm Wed 7 May 08
When will they pull the comment piece for this article ?
Bad hair day at Herald towers or what ...
When will they pull the comment piece for this article ?
Bad hair day at Herald towers or what ...
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 2:57pm Wed 7 May 08
Wendy Alexander said on Newsnight Scotland last night that she had the Prime Minister's backing for a snap referendum on independence.
[bold]Gordon Brewer:[/bold] Is Gordon Brown endorsing your decision to call for a referendum?
[bold]
Wendy Alexander:[/bold] Yes
[bold]Gordon Brewer:[/bold] And he's told you that?
[bold]Wendy Alexander:[/bold] Yes
[bold]Gordon Brewer:[/bold] So any suggestions that you bounced him into this are wrong?
[bold]Wendy Alexander:[/bold] They're wrong.
But when Gordon Brown was asked in the Commons today whether he supports her calling for an immediate referendum, he denied that is what she had said.
Complete shambles from top to bottom.
[bold]Labour are truly in meltdown.[/bold]
Wendy will be the first casualty, end of the week?
Wendy Alexander said on Newsnight Scotland last night that she had the Prime Minister's backing for a snap referendum on independence.
Gordon Brewer: Is Gordon Brown endorsing your decision to call for a referendum?
Wendy Alexander: Yes
Gordon Brewer: And he's told you that?
Wendy Alexander: Yes
Gordon Brewer: So any suggestions that you bounced him into this are wrong?
Wendy Alexander: They're wrong.
But when Gordon Brown was asked in the Commons today whether he supports her calling for an immediate referendum, he denied that is what she had said.
Complete shambles from top to bottom.
Labour are truly in meltdown.
Wendy will be the first casualty, end of the week?
Posted by: Curley Bill, the southwest on 2:59pm Wed 7 May 08
Aye, Vivas - funny thing is, Douglas's article on Wendy's u-turn is funny, concise, and ninety % unbiased. He deserves praise, not brick-bats.
As for the above article, yet again we see how MPs believe themselves a cut above MSPs.
Donohoe states: [quote]"There will come a day when we have that discussion inside the group and we [italic]will[/italic] have Wendy present to discuss the whole situation,"[/quote] (my italics).
Aye, Vivas - funny thing is, Douglas's article on Wendy's u-turn is funny, concise, and ninety % unbiased. He deserves praise, not brick-bats.
As for the above article, yet again we see how MPs believe themselves a cut above MSPs.
Donohoe states:
"There will come a day when we have that discussion inside the group and we will have Wendy present to discuss the whole situation,"
(my italics).
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 2:59pm Wed 7 May 08
The Scottish Public are watching this [italic]Littlebighorn[/italic] of Labour and wondering why Wendy Custer charged.
Panic or Glory?
The Scottish Public are watching this
Littlebighorn of Labour and wondering why Wendy Custer charged.
Panic or Glory?
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 3:05pm Wed 7 May 08
RIP Wendy Alexander, Scottish Labour Leader 2007-2008.
[italic]Suddenly this week, after a brief mental illness at the Scottish parliament, and in the bosom of adoring colleagues...
There will be a funeral tea at which Jackie Baillie and Andy Kerr will eat all the pies and sausage rolls unles you're very very quick.[/italic]
RIP Wendy Alexander, Scottish Labour Leader 2007-2008.
Suddenly this week, after a brief mental illness at the Scottish parliament, and in the bosom of adoring colleagues...
There will be a funeral tea at which Jackie Baillie and Andy Kerr will eat all the pies and sausage rolls unles you're very very quick. Posted by: Im no really here, but over there on 3:05pm Wed 7 May 08
Vivas wrote:[quote]Labour are truly in meltdown.
Wendy will be the first casualty, end of the week?[/quote] You are obviously mistaking Labour for a Political Party that has integrity.
Vivas wrote:
Labour are truly in meltdown.
Wendy will be the first casualty, end of the week?
You are obviously mistaking Labour for a Political Party that has integrity.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 3:08pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Vivas[/bold] wrote:
RIP Wendy Alexander, Scottish Labour Leader 2007-2008.
[italic]Suddenly this week, after a brief mental illness at the Scottish parliament, and in the bosom of adoring colleagues...
There will be a funeral tea at which Jackie Baillie and Andy Kerr will eat all the pies and sausage rolls unles you're very very quick.[/italic] [/quote] LOL
Vivas wrote:
RIP Wendy Alexander, Scottish Labour Leader 2007-2008.
Suddenly this week, after a brief mental illness at the Scottish parliament, and in the bosom of adoring colleagues...
There will be a funeral tea at which Jackie Baillie and Andy Kerr will eat all the pies and sausage rolls unles you're very very quick.
LOL
Posted by: spagan, heisker, scotland on 3:11pm Wed 7 May 08
Out on a limb is she?
On a branch, on a twig, on a leaf???
She's fallen out of the tree.
She's fallen off her perch.
The First Minister must be dreading question time tomorrow - how on earth will he manage to extract the michael from the Labour crew now?
Its just as well its sunny - most folk have wet themselves laughing at the antics of New Labour.
Its sad really, it'll end in tears or sharp knives - we may never hear her dulcit tones again.
Slainte Mhor
Out on a limb is she?
On a branch, on a twig, on a leaf???
She's fallen out of the tree.
She's fallen off her perch.
The First Minister must be dreading question time tomorrow - how on earth will he manage to extract the michael from the Labour crew now?
Its just as well its sunny - most folk have wet themselves laughing at the antics of New Labour.
Its sad really, it'll end in tears or sharp knives - we may never hear her dulcit tones again.
Slainte Mhor
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 3:13pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]spagan[/bold] wrote:
Out on a limb is she? On a branch, on a twig, on a leaf??? She's fallen out of the tree. She's fallen off her perch. The First Minister must be dreading question time tomorrow - how on earth will he manage to extract the michael from the Labour crew now? Its just as well its sunny - most folk have wet themselves laughing at the antics of New Labour. Its sad really, it'll end in tears or sharp knives - we may never hear her dulcit tones again. Slainte Mhor[/quote] Mercy killing ?
Probably for the best ...wounded animals only suffer. Quick wring of the neck and it'll all be over Wendy, don't fret lass you won't feel a thing....
spagan wrote:
Out on a limb is she? On a branch, on a twig, on a leaf??? She's fallen out of the tree. She's fallen off her perch. The First Minister must be dreading question time tomorrow - how on earth will he manage to extract the michael from the Labour crew now? Its just as well its sunny - most folk have wet themselves laughing at the antics of New Labour. Its sad really, it'll end in tears or sharp knives - we may never hear her dulcit tones again. Slainte Mhor
Mercy killing ?
Probably for the best ...wounded animals only suffer. Quick wring of the neck and it'll all be over Wendy, don't fret lass you won't feel a thing....
Posted by: Curley Bill, the southwest on 3:15pm Wed 7 May 08
My mate doesn't follow politics, but we watched the news together and he said, 'Who's that wee wummin wi' the big diddies?'
And I says, 'That's Wendy Alexander - and the diddies are Pauline McNeill and Jackie Baillie.'
My mate doesn't follow politics, but we watched the news together and he said, 'Who's that wee wummin wi' the big diddies?'
And I says, 'That's Wendy Alexander - and the diddies are Pauline McNeill and Jackie Baillie.'
Posted by: Samoyed, Costa del Menie on 3:15pm Wed 7 May 08
Us are not enough for Bendy, she practices wwww-turns.
In any case, it was all bullhorn. Any referendum ordered by Hollyrood, independently of whom is just a CONSULTIVE affair.
Westmonster does have the last word, it's a constitutional, thus reserved matter. Only a referendum ordered from London should be binding.
More than Unionists they are mental Onanists
Us are not enough for Bendy, she practices wwww-turns.
In any case, it was all bullhorn. Any referendum ordered by Hollyrood, independently of whom is just a CONSULTIVE affair.
Westmonster does have the last word, it's a constitutional, thus reserved matter. Only a referendum ordered from London should be binding.
More than Unionists they are mental Onanists
Posted by: Rab The Man, Was My Uncle on 3:17pm Wed 7 May 08
Cancel all my diary appointments....I wouldn't miss First Minister's Questions tomorrow for anything.
[bold]How about you PtbS????[/bold]
Cancel all my diary appointments....I wouldn't miss First Minister's Questions tomorrow for anything.
How about you PtbS???? Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 3:18pm Wed 7 May 08
Dear Mr Presiding Officer.
please can Wendy be excused from FMQ's this week. She has an awful bad dose of something and the doctors don't know when she'll be ready to come back. She'll be staying with a friend in Jersey until she gets better again. Well I mean if she gets better.
feeling your pain etc
Mr. Toom Tabbard, Fife.
Dear Mr Presiding Officer.
please can Wendy be excused from FMQ's this week. She has an awful bad dose of something and the doctors don't know when she'll be ready to come back. She'll be staying with a friend in Jersey until she gets better again. Well I mean if she gets better.
feeling your pain etc
Mr. Toom Tabbard, Fife.
Posted by: A Scottish Voice, Scotland on 3:22pm Wed 7 May 08
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach.
I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach.
I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:22pm Wed 7 May 08
stop slagging off wendy she is a closet nat and kept it very well hidden. Wendy supports independence.
stop slagging off wendy she is a closet nat and kept it very well hidden. Wendy supports independence.
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:23pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]A Scottish Voice[/bold] wrote:
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach. I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.[/quote] nay bother just vote for independnece in 2010
A Scottish Voice wrote:
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach. I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.
nay bother just vote for independnece in 2010
Posted by: Clare, Lanarkshire on 3:24pm Wed 7 May 08
"If it's possible to bring it forward, I would have that referendum tomorrow," said Mr Donohoe.
I bet he would! Labour want this done their way, despite the fact that the proposal put in the SNP manifesto is what we voted for. Salmond also wants to be judged on the performance of his party in government here.
Alexander for me is trying to bring the date forward because as soon as that happens all other Scottish Government plans will take second place to campaigning for a YES vote. Parliamentary business will be disrupted and no other achievements will be possible. That's what Alexander wants. For haven't the SNP had so many successes already that Alexander will want to kill their chances of adding to those?
The other thing is that she wants those still swithering, and I think there are many of those, to bottle it and go for the safe option, the status quo.
I think Salmond can deal with Alexander by reminding her of who is in government, what the pledge actually was on a referendum and what the people voted for. He might also want to remind her that while she has lots of time on her hands now, she has obviously forgotten that governments have busy timetables and business to do for the people they serve.
"If it's possible to bring it forward, I would have that referendum tomorrow," said Mr Donohoe.
I bet he would! Labour want this done their way, despite the fact that the proposal put in the SNP manifesto is what we voted for. Salmond also wants to be judged on the performance of his party in government here.
Alexander for me is trying to bring the date forward because as soon as that happens all other Scottish Government plans will take second place to campaigning for a YES vote. Parliamentary business will be disrupted and no other achievements will be possible. That's what Alexander wants. For haven't the SNP had so many successes already that Alexander will want to kill their chances of adding to those?
The other thing is that she wants those still swithering, and I think there are many of those, to bottle it and go for the safe option, the status quo.
I think Salmond can deal with Alexander by reminding her of who is in government, what the pledge actually was on a referendum and what the people voted for. He might also want to remind her that while she has lots of time on her hands now, she has obviously forgotten that governments have busy timetables and business to do for the people they serve.
Posted by: TheGlaswegian, Edinburgh on 3:24pm Wed 7 May 08
The biggest lesson for us regarding this episode is that Wendy would gladly scupper Scotland in a her rather selfish point scoring attempts. She care nothing of Scotland and like Broon and her brother, she cares only about how long she can remain aboard the gravy train. Her stance the confirms she knows the SNP will be more popular by 2010 and in order to deny Scots the right to make an informed decision - she has attempted the scaremonger and demands we throw our lot in now. She is treating us all with contempt. My vote is for independence but it would suit me better to wait for my undecided countrymen to either feel secure enough to go for it or reject it based on the quality of government and argument we get over the next 3 years. Wendy is playing on fear - the only lever the labour party ever had in Scotland.
If anyone on the Calman Commission had Scotland's best interests at heart, independence would be a real option and they would have a team of researchers analysing all the facts and coming up with a reasoned and well documented conclusion. They reason they are not allowed to consider independence is that once they assembled the truth they simply couldn’t put it in front of us.
The biggest lesson for us regarding this episode is that Wendy would gladly scupper Scotland in a her rather selfish point scoring attempts. She care nothing of Scotland and like Broon and her brother, she cares only about how long she can remain aboard the gravy train. Her stance the confirms she knows the SNP will be more popular by 2010 and in order to deny Scots the right to make an informed decision - she has attempted the scaremonger and demands we throw our lot in now. She is treating us all with contempt. My vote is for independence but it would suit me better to wait for my undecided countrymen to either feel secure enough to go for it or reject it based on the quality of government and argument we get over the next 3 years. Wendy is playing on fear - the only lever the labour party ever had in Scotland.
If anyone on the Calman Commission had Scotland's best interests at heart, independence would be a real option and they would have a team of researchers analysing all the facts and coming up with a reasoned and well documented conclusion. They reason they are not allowed to consider independence is that once they assembled the truth they simply couldn’t put it in front of us.
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:28pm Wed 7 May 08
glaswegian well said you hit the nail on the head. Wendy does not want scotland to have successful government because it shows us how unsuccessful labour were and now she finally realises that labour will never again be the party that people vote for. It took a while right enough for everyone to see through them who knew this would be a benefit of devolution.
glaswegian well said you hit the nail on the head. Wendy does not want scotland to have successful government because it shows us how unsuccessful labour were and now she finally realises that labour will never again be the party that people vote for. It took a while right enough for everyone to see through them who knew this would be a benefit of devolution.
Posted by: haud me back, glasgow on 3:29pm Wed 7 May 08
Car crash politics, Broons foot on the brake and Wendy's on the accelerator....I wonder who will survive...."Aw sthit my wheels have fell off!!"
Car crash politics, Broons foot on the brake and Wendy's on the accelerator....I wonder who will survive...."Aw sthit my wheels have fell off!!"
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:31pm Wed 7 May 08
The country's Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon questioned whether Ms Alexander was "a secret SNP member". from bbc
i wonder if nicola reads the herald page and i wonder if thats why dougie pulled the comments ?
The country's Deputy First Minister Nicola Sturgeon questioned whether Ms Alexander was "a secret SNP member". from bbc
i wonder if nicola reads the herald page and i wonder if thats why dougie pulled the comments ?
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 3:31pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]TheGlaswegian[/bold] wrote:
The biggest lesson for us regarding this episode is that Wendy would gladly scupper Scotland in a her rather selfish point scoring attempts. She care nothing of Scotland and like Broon and her brother, she cares only about how long she can remain aboard the gravy train. Her stance the confirms she knows the SNP will be more popular by 2010 and in order to deny Scots the right to make an informed decision - she has attempted the scaremonger and demands we throw our lot in now. She is treating us all with contempt. My vote is for independence but it would suit me better to wait for my undecided countrymen to either feel secure enough to go for it or reject it based on the quality of government and argument we get over the next 3 years. Wendy is playing on fear - the only lever the labour party ever had in Scotland.
If anyone on the Calman Commission had Scotland's best interests at heart, independence would be a real option and they would have a team of researchers analysing all the facts and coming up with a reasoned and well documented conclusion. They reason they are not allowed to consider independence is that once they assembled the truth they simply couldn’t put it in front of us.[/quote]
It's interesting that the Claman Commission by definition cannot produce recommendations that refute that independence would indeed be the best option.
TheGlaswegian wrote:
The biggest lesson for us regarding this episode is that Wendy would gladly scupper Scotland in a her rather selfish point scoring attempts. She care nothing of Scotland and like Broon and her brother, she cares only about how long she can remain aboard the gravy train. Her stance the confirms she knows the SNP will be more popular by 2010 and in order to deny Scots the right to make an informed decision - she has attempted the scaremonger and demands we throw our lot in now. She is treating us all with contempt. My vote is for independence but it would suit me better to wait for my undecided countrymen to either feel secure enough to go for it or reject it based on the quality of government and argument we get over the next 3 years. Wendy is playing on fear - the only lever the labour party ever had in Scotland.
If anyone on the Calman Commission had Scotland's best interests at heart, independence would be a real option and they would have a team of researchers analysing all the facts and coming up with a reasoned and well documented conclusion. They reason they are not allowed to consider independence is that once they assembled the truth they simply couldn’t put it in front of us.
It's interesting that the Claman Commission by definition cannot produce recommendations that refute that independence would indeed be the best option.
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 3:32pm Wed 7 May 08
I struggle to find the analogy for this weeks FMQ's. So many to choose from. But I'll go with golf.
...Wendys backside is teed up on the 18th fairway. Salmond is having the round of his life, just needs to finish on a birdie to break the course record...
First Wendy question... Alex, thwack with the driver ... Wendy 350 yards straight down the middle....
Second Wendy question... Alex, 50 yard pitch high in the air, Wendy hits the green with massive spin and rolls towrads the pin, clanging her napper off the pine...
Third Wendy question...Alex gently rolls Wendy into the hole with a satisfying clunk.
The crowd goes wild and as is traditional, Alex throws Wendy into the throng. Some wee boy finds her in the long grass and keeps her on his mantelpiece ... or tries to sell her on ebay.
[bold]FORE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/bold]
I struggle to find the analogy for this weeks FMQ's. So many to choose from. But I'll go with golf.
...Wendys backside is teed up on the 18th fairway. Salmond is having the round of his life, just needs to finish on a birdie to break the course record...
First Wendy question... Alex, thwack with the driver ... Wendy 350 yards straight down the middle....
Second Wendy question... Alex, 50 yard pitch high in the air, Wendy hits the green with massive spin and rolls towrads the pin, clanging her napper off the pine...
Third Wendy question...Alex gently rolls Wendy into the hole with a satisfying clunk.
The crowd goes wild and as is traditional, Alex throws Wendy into the throng. Some wee boy finds her in the long grass and keeps her on his mantelpiece ... or tries to sell her on ebay.
FORE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Posted by: Alex on 3:37pm Wed 7 May 08
Samoyed, Costa del Menie
Wrong my friend. This is a popular misconception which is encouraged by Westminster. The “Right of Self Determination of a Nation” is guaranteed by the UN Charter.
As I have said repeatedly on these columns it was the Council of Europe that instigated the Devolution process NOT Tony Blair. The CoE instructed John Major to take action under pain of sanctions if he did not comply however Major was replaced by Blair before he could take action so the instruction passed too Blair who pretended that it was labour policy.
If the people of Scotland decide they want to be an independent Nation Westminster cannot stop them. If they attempt to do so they would be ejected from the EU.
Samoyed, Costa del Menie
Wrong my friend. This is a popular misconception which is encouraged by Westminster. The “Right of Self Determination of a Nation” is guaranteed by the UN Charter.
As I have said repeatedly on these columns it was the Council of Europe that instigated the Devolution process NOT Tony Blair. The CoE instructed John Major to take action under pain of sanctions if he did not comply however Major was replaced by Blair before he could take action so the instruction passed too Blair who pretended that it was labour policy.
If the people of Scotland decide they want to be an independent Nation Westminster cannot stop them. If they attempt to do so they would be ejected from the EU.
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 3:39pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]A Scottish Voice[/bold] wrote:
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach. I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.[/quote] Magic Roundabout! Now where's Zebedee?
A Scottish Voice wrote:
After watching Gorgon Brown back track on Wendy Alexanders comments, this is less of a U-turn on a U-turn and more of Merry-Go-Round at Blackpool Pleasure Beach. I'm beginning to get dizzy. Can someone stop this thing and let me off.
Magic Roundabout! Now where's Zebedee?
Posted by: George Laird, Glasgow on 3:52pm Wed 7 May 08
Dear All
I think that Wendy Alexander should be allowed to bring her bill before Holyrood and then the SNP, Lib Dems and the Tories can over her down.
It would seal her fate and make her look like a fool.
I notice she says that Brown has given her support and it is a matter for her, it seems to me to be more "dithering" and a further example why English Labour MP's must remove him from Office.
Gordon Brown has lost complete control of his Party and is in freefall.
Tony Blair must be so pleased that his "backstabber" is finished.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Dear All
I think that Wendy Alexander should be allowed to bring her bill before Holyrood and then the SNP, Lib Dems and the Tories can over her down.
It would seal her fate and make her look like a fool.
I notice she says that Brown has given her support and it is a matter for her, it seems to me to be more "dithering" and a further example why English Labour MP's must remove him from Office.
Gordon Brown has lost complete control of his Party and is in freefall.
Tony Blair must be so pleased that his "backstabber" is finished.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:55pm Wed 7 May 08
george she cant bring it before parliament because she needs the support of 18 msps and she also cant because you cant bring a private members bill if government is going to bring in a similar bill.
george she cant bring it before parliament because she needs the support of 18 msps and she also cant because you cant bring a private members bill if government is going to bring in a similar bill.
Posted by: Morag, Peeblesshire on 3:55pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Alex[/bold] wrote:
Samoyed, Costa del Menie Wrong my friend. This is a popular misconception which is encouraged by Westminster. The “Right of Self Determination of a Nation” is guaranteed by the UN Charter. As I have said repeatedly on these columns it was the Council of Europe that instigated the Devolution process NOT Tony Blair. The CoE instructed John Major to take action under pain of sanctions if he did not comply however Major was replaced by Blair before he could take action so the instruction passed too Blair who pretended that it was labour policy. If the people of Scotland decide they want to be an independent Nation Westminster cannot stop them. If they attempt to do so they would be ejected from the EU. [/quote] While I think we're a touch short of evidence on the specifics of this claim, the general thrust is correct.
Nobody can stop the Scottish Government organising and running a referendum if that's what it has voted for. If, following a "yes" majority, Westminster were then to deny the legitimacy of this exercise, Westminster would be in extremely hot water internationally.
Consider Westminster's effusive support of Montenegro, Kosovo, indeed all the new eastern accession states the the EU. They'd be roasted.
Alex wrote:
Samoyed, Costa del Menie Wrong my friend. This is a popular misconception which is encouraged by Westminster. The “Right of Self Determination of a Nation” is guaranteed by the UN Charter. As I have said repeatedly on these columns it was the Council of Europe that instigated the Devolution process NOT Tony Blair. The CoE instructed John Major to take action under pain of sanctions if he did not comply however Major was replaced by Blair before he could take action so the instruction passed too Blair who pretended that it was labour policy. If the people of Scotland decide they want to be an independent Nation Westminster cannot stop them. If they attempt to do so they would be ejected from the EU.
While I think we're a touch short of evidence on the specifics of this claim, the general thrust is correct.
Nobody can stop the Scottish Government organising and running a referendum if that's what it has voted for. If, following a "yes" majority, Westminster were then to deny the legitimacy of this exercise, Westminster would be in extremely hot water internationally.
Consider Westminster's effusive support of Montenegro, Kosovo, indeed all the new eastern accession states the the EU. They'd be roasted.
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 3:56pm Wed 7 May 08
Herald has now pulled story + comments on its earlier "900 jobs to go as Goldfish closes Scottish operation" headline.
Is this one of these days at the Herald where you take your kids to work and give them the run of the place ? 8 year-olds in charge of the website and pulling stories and comments right left and centre is all I can put it down to.
Edit: unionist 8 year-olds.
Herald has now pulled story + comments on its earlier "900 jobs to go as Goldfish closes Scottish operation" headline.
Is this one of these days at the Herald where you take your kids to work and give them the run of the place ? 8 year-olds in charge of the website and pulling stories and comments right left and centre is all I can put it down to.
Edit: unionist 8 year-olds.
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 3:56pm Wed 7 May 08
all wendy has done is ensure that we are going to be talking about independence for the next two years.
all wendy has done is ensure that we are going to be talking about independence for the next two years.
Posted by: pete, Bearsden on 3:57pm Wed 7 May 08
Methinks Wicked Wendy is lying again - no, I think they're all lying again.
Methinks Wicked Wendy is lying again - no, I think they're all lying again.
Posted by: talorthane on 4:01pm Wed 7 May 08
Another beautiful twist to the story.
Brown has now, inadvertantly, supported the SNP's choice of timing for the referendum.
Brown said to Cameron:
[quote]"What the leader of the Labour Party in Scotland was pointing to was the hollowness of the SNP that said they wanted independence, said they wanted it immediately and now wanted to postpone a referendum until 2010-11."
"That's what she was pointing out and she was making it clear that what the SNP was doing was against their election manifesto."[/quote]
This was picked up by Stewart Hoise of the SNP, on a point of order saying:
[quote]"The Prime Minister said the Scottish Government was seeking to 'postpone a referendum in 2010/11' and that the Scottish Government was acting 'against its manifesto'.
"That manifesto was explicit in setting out a timetable for that referendum in 2010 and in misrepresenting this, I fear the Prime Minister has inadvertently misled the House.
"Far from the referendum being delayed or a manifesto promise broken it is one the Scottish Government intends to keep."[/quote]
Now, neither Brown nor the Labour Party can question the SNP's timescale as he has urged them to stick to their manifesto commitment.
Another beautiful twist to the story.
Brown has now, inadvertantly, supported the SNP's choice of timing for the referendum.
Brown said to Cameron:
"What the leader of the Labour Party in Scotland was pointing to was the hollowness of the SNP that said they wanted independence, said they wanted it immediately and now wanted to postpone a referendum until 2010-11."
"That's what she was pointing out and she was making it clear that what the SNP was doing was against their election manifesto."
This was picked up by Stewart Hoise of the SNP, on a point of order saying:
"The Prime Minister said the Scottish Government was seeking to 'postpone a referendum in 2010/11' and that the Scottish Government was acting 'against its manifesto'.
"That manifesto was explicit in setting out a timetable for that referendum in 2010 and in misrepresenting this, I fear the Prime Minister has inadvertently misled the House.
"Far from the referendum being delayed or a manifesto promise broken it is one the Scottish Government intends to keep."
Now, neither Brown nor the Labour Party can question the SNP's timescale as he has urged them to stick to their manifesto commitment.
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 4:01pm Wed 7 May 08
morag
[quote]While I think we're a touch short of evidence on the specifics of this claim, the general thrust is correct.[/quote]
morag read this in conjunction with the scotland UN papers........
https://wcd.coe.int/
ViewDoc.jsp?Ref=Decl
-09.10.93&Language=l
anEnglish&Ver=origin
al&Site=COE&BackColo
rInternet=9999CC&Bac
kColorIntranet=FFBB5
5&BackColorLogged=FF
AC75
morag
While I think we're a touch short of evidence on the specifics of this claim, the general thrust is correct.
morag read this in conjunction with the scotland UN papers........
https://wcd.coe.int/
ViewDoc.jsp?Ref=Decl
-09.10.93&Language=l
anEnglish&Ver=origin
al&Site=COE&BackColo
rInternet=9999CC&Bac
kColorIntranet=FFBB5
5&BackColorLogged=FF
AC75
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 4:01pm Wed 7 May 08
If there is a god ... then Jackie Baiile would be rolled out tonight on Newsnight Scotland to fight Wendys corner.
When Jackie talks, I listen.
[italic]Incredulously....[/italic] but I listen LOL !
If there is a god ... then Jackie Baiile would be rolled out tonight on Newsnight Scotland to fight Wendys corner.
When Jackie talks, I listen.
Incredulously.... but I listen LOL !
Posted by: Karin, glasgae. on 4:02pm Wed 7 May 08
see once you read them both youll see it. You may have to go to the national library of scotland right enough to do this.
see once you read them both youll see it. You may have to go to the national library of scotland right enough to do this.
Posted by: talorthane on 4:06pm Wed 7 May 08
Vivas
Who exactly is the Deputy Leader for Labour in Scotland?
Is it Baillie?
I wonder if she's worried about FMQs tomorrow, in the event that Wendy doesn't show up.
Last night they were all grins and determination.
Today, they must be ... well, pretty terrified of tomorrow.
Vivas
Who exactly is the Deputy Leader for Labour in Scotland?
Is it Baillie?
I wonder if she's worried about FMQs tomorrow, in the event that Wendy doesn't show up.
Last night they were all grins and determination.
Today, they must be ... well, pretty terrified of tomorrow.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:10pm Wed 7 May 08
A bit of a tangent but hey.....
[bold]FREE PERSONAL CARE[/bold]
[italic]www.scotland.gov.uk/
News/Releases/2008/0
5/07143856[/italic]
The additional £40 million per year identified by Lord Sutherland as vital for the delivery of free personal and nursing care across Scotland [bold]will be met by the Scottish Government[/bold] , it was confirmed today.
The additional funding was announced by Cabinet Secretary for Health and Wellbeing Nicola Sturgeon in her response to Lord Sutherland's independent review of Free Personal and Nursing Care policy.
Ms Sturgeon advised the Scottish Parliament that all the recommendations made by Lord Sutherland have been accepted, and will form part of a wider package of measures being developed with local government.
Ms Sturgeon said:
[quote]"The Sutherland Review concluded that the UK Government was wrong to stop payments of Attendance Allowance for residents in Scotland, while continuing to make it available for those living in the rest of the UK. [bold]Clearly it is wrong that the Scottish Budget should bear those costs.[/bold]
"We will seek the reinstatement of this funding, and have asked for this issue to be included on the agenda of the next Joint Ministerial Committee meeting with Ministers from around the UK."
[/quote]
The pressure is mounting on Brown, maybe some BBC, ITV or Herald Journalists can ask Wendy what ehr view on the lost £30M is, Margaret Curran & Hendry Ncleish have already confirmed that it was wrong to withdraw the funds......
[bold]
What's Wendy's view on the £30M due to Scotland?[/bold]
A bit of a tangent but hey.....
FREE PERSONAL CARE
www.scotland.gov.uk/
News/Releases/2008/0
5/07143856
The additional £40 million per year identified by Lord Sutherland as vital for the delivery of free personal and nursing care across Scotland
will be met by the Scottish Government , it was confirmed today.
The additional funding was announced by Cabinet Secretary for Health and Wellbeing Nicola Sturgeon in her response to Lord Sutherland's independent review of Free Personal and Nursing Care policy.
Ms Sturgeon advised the Scottish Parliament that all the recommendations made by Lord Sutherland have been accepted, and will form part of a wider package of measures being developed with local government.
Ms Sturgeon said:
"The Sutherland Review concluded that the UK Government was wrong to stop payments of Attendance Allowance for residents in Scotland, while continuing to make it available for those living in the rest of the UK. Clearly it is wrong that the Scottish Budget should bear those costs.
"We will seek the reinstatement of this funding, and have asked for this issue to be included on the agenda of the next Joint Ministerial Committee meeting with Ministers from around the UK."
The pressure is mounting on Brown, maybe some BBC, ITV or Herald Journalists can ask Wendy what ehr view on the lost £30M is, Margaret Curran & Hendry Ncleish have already confirmed that it was wrong to withdraw the funds......
What's Wendy's view on the £30M due to Scotland?
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:21pm Wed 7 May 08
Van Helsing - Nat Slayer, Lanarkshire on 4:17pm today
valid point re: address
Van Helsing - Nat Slayer, Lanarkshire on 4:17pm today
valid point re: address
Posted by: teamdroid on 4:21pm Wed 7 May 08
George, of the 18 MSPs, at least 2 parties must be represented. So a LibDem, Tory, SNP, or Green will have to sponsor it as well. Academic really, since the clause about government legislation not being duplicated nixes it. However, it does further demonstrate the complete inability of the likes of Alexander to read a rulebook.
Oh wait, we knew that already.
George, of the 18 MSPs, at least 2 parties must be represented. So a LibDem, Tory, SNP, or Green will have to sponsor it as well. Academic really, since the clause about government legislation not being duplicated nixes it. However, it does further demonstrate the complete inability of the likes of Alexander to read a rulebook.
Oh wait, we knew that already.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:23pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]teamdroid[/bold] wrote:
George, of the 18 MSPs, at least 2 parties must be represented. So a LibDem, Tory, SNP, or Green will have to sponsor it as well. Academic really, since the clause about government legislation not being duplicated nixes it. However, it does further demonstrate the complete inability of the likes of Alexander to read a rulebook.
Oh wait, we knew that already.[/quote]
mmmm. for someone apparently renowned for her grasp of detail, she's now fallen twice to the details of public life and parliamentary regulation.
But if she goes who will replace her.
Van helsing, who'd be your odds on nag?
teamdroid wrote:
George, of the 18 MSPs, at least 2 parties must be represented. So a LibDem, Tory, SNP, or Green will have to sponsor it as well. Academic really, since the clause about government legislation not being duplicated nixes it. However, it does further demonstrate the complete inability of the likes of Alexander to read a rulebook.
Oh wait, we knew that already.
mmmm. for someone apparently renowned for her grasp of detail, she's now fallen twice to the details of public life and parliamentary regulation.
But if she goes who will replace her.
Van helsing, who'd be your odds on nag?
Posted by: Davie08, a basement at Edinburgh uni on 4:23pm Wed 7 May 08
Why would a hoard of nats with torches descend on Wendy? We love Wendy!
Why would a hoard of nats with torches descend on Wendy? We love Wendy!
Posted by: talorthane, Glasgow on 4:24pm Wed 7 May 08
Wardog
For someone apparently reknowned for her dazzling intellect she has been astoundingly stupid and corrupt
Wardog
For someone apparently reknowned for her dazzling intellect she has been astoundingly stupid and corrupt
Posted by: Mike, Edinburgh on 4:26pm Wed 7 May 08
The reason that Wendy is backpeddling is plain and simple.
Firstly the silly moo didnt realise that NO PARTY can raise a bill/white paper if the Government has already gave notice that they intend to raise the same one. And in the case of the Referendum the SNP won Government on a manifesto that commited it to introduce a referendum on Independance.
Secondly, Opposition parties need the support of a certain amount of other opposition Parties. Somehow I dont think the LibDems and Tories are about to do a Wendy Uturn. Help ma Boab she sure stuffed up, or as we call it she Wendied Big Time.
Thirdly, A group of Scots fought very hard to have a submission accepted by the United Nations, which after great pain was accepted as a clear and concise explanation of the Sovereignty of the Scottish People over their land and Government. They then fought for two years with the All Powerfull European Commision who are responsable for all matters to do with the EU Constitution and Laws. The EU Commision were forced to accept the same docuementation and UN ruling were applicable to the European Constitution. Hence the reason that Tony Blair had no choice but to form a Scottish Parliament and a Welsh Assembly. These were minimum measures of compliance, that unfortunately were not made available to the Welsh and Scottish People by the Unionist Media, especially the BBC and ITV.
Conclusion: Any Vote by the Scottish People for Independance through the abolition of the Act of Union, is in fact a legit Legally binding Vote applicable in both the EU and the United Nations.
After the fiasco of Kosovo, when the EU refused Russian objections to their new found freedom, Mr Putin was mightily peed off. I am fairly sure Alex Salmond is aware of the situation, and will, after the Scottish People have voted in the majority to retake Sovereignty Over their Lands, be making a B line to the UN. I am fairly sure that the former countries of the Commonwealth, the Chinese and the Russians and also the former members of the old Soviet Union will have our freedom granted to us in a unamonous Vote.
The Future looks Great for all Scots and our beloved Country.
SAOR ALBA TO ALL
The reason that Wendy is backpeddling is plain and simple.
Firstly the silly moo didnt realise that NO PARTY can raise a bill/white paper if the Government has already gave notice that they intend to raise the same one. And in the case of the Referendum the SNP won Government on a manifesto that commited it to introduce a referendum on Independance.
Secondly, Opposition parties need the support of a certain amount of other opposition Parties. Somehow I dont think the LibDems and Tories are about to do a Wendy Uturn. Help ma Boab she sure stuffed up, or as we call it she Wendied Big Time.
Thirdly, A group of Scots fought very hard to have a submission accepted by the United Nations, which after great pain was accepted as a clear and concise explanation of the Sovereignty of the Scottish People over their land and Government. They then fought for two years with the All Powerfull European Commision who are responsable for all matters to do with the EU Constitution and Laws. The EU Commision were forced to accept the same docuementation and UN ruling were applicable to the European Constitution. Hence the reason that Tony Blair had no choice but to form a Scottish Parliament and a Welsh Assembly. These were minimum measures of compliance, that unfortunately were not made available to the Welsh and Scottish People by the Unionist Media, especially the BBC and ITV.
Conclusion: Any Vote by the Scottish People for Independance through the abolition of the Act of Union, is in fact a legit Legally binding Vote applicable in both the EU and the United Nations.
After the fiasco of Kosovo, when the EU refused Russian objections to their new found freedom, Mr Putin was mightily peed off. I am fairly sure Alex Salmond is aware of the situation, and will, after the Scottish People have voted in the majority to retake Sovereignty Over their Lands, be making a B line to the UN. I am fairly sure that the former countries of the Commonwealth, the Chinese and the Russians and also the former members of the old Soviet Union will have our freedom granted to us in a unamonous Vote.
The Future looks Great for all Scots and our beloved Country.
SAOR ALBA TO ALL
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 4:29pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]talorthane[/bold] wrote:
Vivas Who exactly is the Deputy Leader for Labour in Scotland? Is it Baillie? I wonder if she's worried about FMQs tomorrow, in the event that Wendy doesn't show up. Last night they were all grins and determination. Today, they must be ... well, pretty terrified of tomorrow. [/quote] It's Cathy Jamieson mon ami.
She's another SLAB youtube hero.... If you go there you'l find this and others. Enjoy !
http://tartanhero.bl
ogspot.com/2007/04/c
athy-jamieson-on-new
snight-political.htm
l
talorthane wrote:
Vivas Who exactly is the Deputy Leader for Labour in Scotland? Is it Baillie? I wonder if she's worried about FMQs tomorrow, in the event that Wendy doesn't show up. Last night they were all grins and determination. Today, they must be ... well, pretty terrified of tomorrow.
It's Cathy Jamieson mon ami.
She's another SLAB youtube hero.... If you go there you'l find this and others. Enjoy !
http://tartanhero.bl
ogspot.com/2007/04/c
athy-jamieson-on-new
snight-political.htm
l
Posted by: Ray, Glasgow on 4:29pm Wed 7 May 08
One good thing?
As you may know if you saw my earlier posts on another thread which now seems to have disappeared completely (I am almost starting to think the Herald is involved in censoring) I am no fan of Wendy. As a life long labour supporter I am ashamed and embarrassed both by her performance and obvious lack of grip on reality.
I am now hoping after watching PMQ’s that labour msp’s are so embarrassed by the answers that Brown gave in direct contradiction to what Wendy has said that they all grow spines and force her to resign.
If the Scottish Labour Party is to survive and be an effective opposition we need to ditch Wendy now.
One good thing?
As you may know if you saw my earlier posts on another thread which now seems to have disappeared completely (I am almost starting to think the Herald is involved in censoring) I am no fan of Wendy. As a life long labour supporter I am ashamed and embarrassed both by her performance and obvious lack of grip on reality.
I am now hoping after watching PMQ’s that labour msp’s are so embarrassed by the answers that Brown gave in direct contradiction to what Wendy has said that they all grow spines and force her to resign.
If the Scottish Labour Party is to survive and be an effective opposition we need to ditch Wendy now.
Posted by: Wullie, Aberdeen on 4:30pm Wed 7 May 08
Wendy Alexander scweeeches
'' I dont want a wwefffawwendumm, never, never, never.''
5 minutes later
'' I want a wweffawwendumm, now, now now. Alex Salmond is a wascal and a wotter.''
Typical bloodyy woman, canny make up her mind.
Listen love, you are sounding like across between Elmer Fudd and Tweety Pie. Remember your diction. Round tones, round tones.
Wendy Alexander scweeeches
'' I dont want a wwefffawwendumm, never, never, never.''
5 minutes later
'' I want a wweffawwendumm, now, now now. Alex Salmond is a wascal and a wotter.''
Typical bloodyy woman, canny make up her mind.
Listen love, you are sounding like across between Elmer Fudd and Tweety Pie. Remember your diction. Round tones, round tones.
Posted by: Van Helsing - Nat Slayer, Lanarkshire on 4:31pm Wed 7 May 08
Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when?
Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when?
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:31pm Wed 7 May 08
Ok Van Hellsin, here's my odds for you to gander at, fancy a flutter?
Who are the other Nags?
Where's my formbook.....
[bold]Duncan Mcneill 4-1[/bold]
Ran the wrong way recently and had problems chasing 'Trumpton' in the last Meadie Estate hurdles.... needs to focus to make it round this course, he's not back in the Greenock Pub Crawl this time....
[bold]Lordy Lordy 4-1[/bold]
Ridden by Herr Von Foulkes in the Cummnock Steeple Chase recently to within a whisker, or should that be whiskey of win(e)ing it. Good on the soft going, though has been know to tumble on occasion.
[bold]Andy Kerr 4-1[/bold]
Ex flat racer who didn’t really empress as Finance Minister when out over political hurdles. He has since changed trainers & portfolios and although probably worth another crack needs to learn to question consultants when they are feeding him lousy research and flawed recommendations
[bold]Cathy Jamieson 5-1[/bold]
Second last time out at Holyrood over 8 furlongs which proved too much a test of stamina, back today over preferred 16 furlongs and at home with the going soft....on crime
[bold]Margaret Curran 12-1[/bold]
Odds look a little short but she likes the testing conditions and usually flies roudn the studio jumps like a Kamikaze with a death wish
[bold]Jackie Baille 15-1[/bold]
Weight is an issue for this young filllee, but hoping for a bold showing, if she could keep her nose down and run the race without stopping to eat the brambles....
[bold]Des McNulty 16-1 [/bold]
'DESert O'kid' ran just behind 'Out of Sight , Out of Mind' earlier in the season, albeit 12th of the 19 runners in the John Smith House Steeplechase he still ran respectably....for a three legged beast.
[bold]Iain Gray 18-1[/bold]
A maiden run after too many tries but a new handler has found an excellent opportunity to exorcise this particular financial runner's demons, will be hoping that being in front won't involve crunching those numbers too much... previous attempts have resulted in disqualification
[bold]Malcolm Chisholm 25-1[/bold]
A maestro on the all-weather circuit, disliked by other riders for his bright ginger main and strange facial hair but loved by the left side of the course for principled outbursts
[bold]Rhona Brankin 50-1[/bold]
A fair fillie with a right pair of gnashers, she's been none to nibble her jockey's when the going get's tough. Outside chance after coming last in the EU Fishing Quota Derby.
[bold]Johann Lamont 50-1[/bold]
Coming in form the cold (war), this nag ran a fine race down the left-hand side of the Falkirk National. Occasion rebellious streaks with her jockeys though would single her out as a long shot.
Ok Van Hellsin, here's my odds for you to gander at, fancy a flutter?
Who are the other Nags?
Where's my formbook.....
Duncan Mcneill 4-1
Ran the wrong way recently and had problems chasing 'Trumpton' in the last Meadie Estate hurdles.... needs to focus to make it round this course, he's not back in the Greenock Pub Crawl this time....
Lordy Lordy 4-1
Ridden by Herr Von Foulkes in the Cummnock Steeple Chase recently to within a whisker, or should that be whiskey of win(e)ing it. Good on the soft going, though has been know to tumble on occasion.
Andy Kerr 4-1
Ex flat racer who didn’t really empress as Finance Minister when out over political hurdles. He has since changed trainers & portfolios and although probably worth another crack needs to learn to question consultants when they are feeding him lousy research and flawed recommendations
Cathy Jamieson 5-1
Second last time out at Holyrood over 8 furlongs which proved too much a test of stamina, back today over preferred 16 furlongs and at home with the going soft....on crime
Margaret Curran 12-1
Odds look a little short but she likes the testing conditions and usually flies roudn the studio jumps like a Kamikaze with a death wish
Jackie Baille 15-1
Weight is an issue for this young filllee, but hoping for a bold showing, if she could keep her nose down and run the race without stopping to eat the brambles....
Des McNulty 16-1
'DESert O'kid' ran just behind 'Out of Sight , Out of Mind' earlier in the season, albeit 12th of the 19 runners in the John Smith House Steeplechase he still ran respectably....for a three legged beast.
Iain Gray 18-1
A maiden run after too many tries but a new handler has found an excellent opportunity to exorcise this particular financial runner's demons, will be hoping that being in front won't involve crunching those numbers too much... previous attempts have resulted in disqualification
Malcolm Chisholm 25-1
A maestro on the all-weather circuit, disliked by other riders for his bright ginger main and strange facial hair but loved by the left side of the course for principled outbursts
Rhona Brankin 50-1
A fair fillie with a right pair of gnashers, she's been none to nibble her jockey's when the going get's tough. Outside chance after coming last in the EU Fishing Quota Derby.
Johann Lamont 50-1
Coming in form the cold (war), this nag ran a fine race down the left-hand side of the Falkirk National. Occasion rebellious streaks with her jockeys though would single her out as a long shot.
Posted by: Vivas, Embra on 4:34pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Ray[/bold] wrote:
One good thing? As you may know if you saw my earlier posts on another thread which now seems to have disappeared completely (I am almost starting to think the Herald is involved in censoring) I am no fan of Wendy. As a life long labour supporter I am ashamed and embarrassed both by her performance and obvious lack of grip on reality. I am now hoping after watching PMQ’s that labour msp’s are so embarrassed by the answers that Brown gave in direct contradiction to what Wendy has said that they all grow spines and force her to resign. If the Scottish Labour Party is to survive and be an effective opposition we need to ditch Wendy now. [/quote] Was enjoying your posts until we got so rudely interrupted ray.
Welcome back. As I said to you before, you're in a tight spot retaining your traditional Labour principles with the party in it's current sad state.
I hope we can both one day be voting for a Labour party (of some kind) worth a ****. In my case I hope that will be after independence, but I'll leave you to agonise over that. Good luck sir (genuinely).
Ray wrote:
One good thing? As you may know if you saw my earlier posts on another thread which now seems to have disappeared completely (I am almost starting to think the Herald is involved in censoring) I am no fan of Wendy. As a life long labour supporter I am ashamed and embarrassed both by her performance and obvious lack of grip on reality. I am now hoping after watching PMQ’s that labour msp’s are so embarrassed by the answers that Brown gave in direct contradiction to what Wendy has said that they all grow spines and force her to resign. If the Scottish Labour Party is to survive and be an effective opposition we need to ditch Wendy now.
Was enjoying your posts until we got so rudely interrupted ray.
Welcome back. As I said to you before, you're in a tight spot retaining your traditional Labour principles with the party in it's current sad state.
I hope we can both one day be voting for a Labour party (of some kind) worth a ****. In my case I hope that will be after independence, but I'll leave you to agonise over that. Good luck sir (genuinely).
Posted by: George Laird, Glasgow on 4:35pm Wed 7 May 08
Dear Van Helsing nat slayer
“As I've said before, I don't like Wendy Alexander”.
That makes two of us.
“You don't have to agree with her politics”.
Given she changes her mind at every opportunity, she doesn’t either.
“But why did you mention where she lived?”
Is this a state secret? It is already in the public domain as far as I am aware. I think it is relevant so that people who look at her and her myths of helping the poor know that she enjoys a cushy middle class life in luxury in the trendy west end of Glasgow.
“Is this relevent?”
I think so.
“Or do you expect hoards of Nats carrying fiery torches to descend on her home?”
Why should this be limited to nats? I am sure that there are other interested people might be interested in where she stays.
“For someone involved in human rights you don't seem to care too much about her right to her personal privacy”.
She has the right to privacy in her own house and I fully support that principle, her human rights have not been violated perhaps you don’t know the Human Rights Act 1998 or the UN Charter on Human Rights as well as you should.
“I'm sure you wont tell us all where you live?”
Why my labour supporting “friend” that is were you are wrong, here is my address.
2/1 12 Salen Street, Craigton, Glasgow, G52 1EB
“Usual human rights crap - only on your terms”.
I have the guts to put my name on my postings, not only that I have the conviction to put my address up to prove you wrong.
Will you have the conviction to do the same or to quote as Labour troll.
“Usual human rights crap - only on your terms”.
If you don’t I will take as simple cowardice.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Dear Van Helsing nat slayer
“As I've said before, I don't like Wendy Alexander”.
That makes two of us.
“You don't have to agree with her politics”.
Given she changes her mind at every opportunity, she doesn’t either.
“But why did you mention where she lived?”
Is this a state secret? It is already in the public domain as far as I am aware. I think it is relevant so that people who look at her and her myths of helping the poor know that she enjoys a cushy middle class life in luxury in the trendy west end of Glasgow.
“Is this relevent?”
I think so.
“Or do you expect hoards of Nats carrying fiery torches to descend on her home?”
Why should this be limited to nats? I am sure that there are other interested people might be interested in where she stays.
“For someone involved in human rights you don't seem to care too much about her right to her personal privacy”.
She has the right to privacy in her own house and I fully support that principle, her human rights have not been violated perhaps you don’t know the Human Rights Act 1998 or the UN Charter on Human Rights as well as you should.
“I'm sure you wont tell us all where you live?”
Why my labour supporting “friend” that is were you are wrong, here is my address.
2/1 12 Salen Street, Craigton, Glasgow, G52 1EB
“Usual human rights crap - only on your terms”.
I have the guts to put my name on my postings, not only that I have the conviction to put my address up to prove you wrong.
Will you have the conviction to do the same or to quote as Labour troll.
“Usual human rights crap - only on your terms”.
If you don’t I will take as simple cowardice.
Yours sincerely
George Laird
The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University
Posted by: pony, vancouver island canada on 4:35pm Wed 7 May 08
I CAN"T STOP LAUGHING MY SIDE HURTS,WHAT A GREAT COMEDY,STARRING WENDY AND BROON.
I CAN"T STOP LAUGHING MY SIDE HURTS,WHAT A GREAT COMEDY,STARRING WENDY AND BROON.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:36pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Van Helsing - Nat Slayer[/bold] wrote:
Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when? [/quote]
[bold]SNP Manifesto 2007[/bold]
[quote]Publication of a White Paper detailing the concept of Scottish independence in the modern world as part of preparations for offering Scots the opportunity to decide on independence in a referendum, with a likely date of [bold]2010[/bold] [/quote]
Van Helsing - Nat Slayer wrote:
Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when?
SNP Manifesto 2007
Publication of a White Paper detailing the concept of Scottish independence in the modern world as part of preparations for offering Scots the opportunity to decide on independence in a referendum, with a likely date of 2010
Posted by: Van Helsing - Nat Slayer, Lanarkshire on 4:37pm Wed 7 May 08
Wardog. It's a sad fact but I don't fancy any of them! Fat Eck is good as what he does and I'm afraid this lot wouldn't cut it against him. Labour are not overly endowed with quality at the moment. Maybe some dark horse may emerge in the near future.
Wardog. It's a sad fact but I don't fancy any of them! Fat Eck is good as what he does and I'm afraid this lot wouldn't cut it against him. Labour are not overly endowed with quality at the moment. Maybe some dark horse may emerge in the near future.
Posted by: Van Helsing - Nat Slayer, Lanarkshire on 4:39pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Wardog[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Van Helsing - Nat Slayer[/bold] wrote: Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when? [/quote] [bold]SNP Manifesto 2007[/bold] [quote]Publication of a White Paper detailing the concept of Scottish independence in the modern world as part of preparations for offering Scots the opportunity to decide on independence in a referendum, with a likely date of [bold]2010[/bold] [/quote] [/quote] It was always going to be 2010 for starters. But the word 'likely' is the key. It won't be 2010 if Fat Eck thinks he'll lose - and I don't blame him!
Wardog wrote:
Van Helsing - Nat Slayer wrote: Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear from a referendum and welcome it. But when?
SNP Manifesto 2007 Publication of a White Paper detailing the concept of Scottish independence in the modern world as part of preparations for offering Scots the opportunity to decide on independence in a referendum, with a likely date of 2010
It was always going to be 2010 for starters. But the word 'likely' is the key. It won't be 2010 if Fat Eck thinks he'll lose - and I don't blame him!
Posted by: Jwil, Lanarkshire on 4:39pm Wed 7 May 08
Brown Ttld the Commons at PM questions that the Calman commission were discussing [italic]all[/italic] the options. Liar! What audience is he speaking to? Its certainly not to to Scotland.
Brown Ttld the Commons at PM questions that the Calman commission were discussing
all the options. Liar! What audience is he speaking to? Its certainly not to to Scotland.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:40pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Van Helsing - Nat Slayer[/bold] wrote:
Wardog. It's a sad fact but I don't fancy any of them! Fat Eck is good as what he does and I'm afraid this lot wouldn't cut it against him. Labour are not overly endowed with quality at the moment. Maybe some dark horse may emerge in the near future.[/quote]
Doesn't sound like you Van Helsing
You sound depressed, you never know, independence might just eb the bets thing that happened to Labour in Scotland. A Chance to reform as a true left of centre party of the working classes (?)
Never mind for the moment though, Auntie Bella is still flying the unionist flag high with her wee pet snake, Stephen Nichol(?)
bring on 2010-11 indeed!
Van Helsing - Nat Slayer wrote:
Wardog. It's a sad fact but I don't fancy any of them! Fat Eck is good as what he does and I'm afraid this lot wouldn't cut it against him. Labour are not overly endowed with quality at the moment. Maybe some dark horse may emerge in the near future.
Doesn't sound like you Van Helsing
You sound depressed, you never know, independence might just eb the bets thing that happened to Labour in Scotland. A Chance to reform as a true left of centre party of the working classes (?)
Never mind for the moment though, Auntie Bella is still flying the unionist flag high with her wee pet snake, Stephen Nichol(?)
bring on 2010-11 indeed!
Posted by: Wullie, Aberdeen on 4:41pm Wed 7 May 08
Cat Slayer says
''Eck is good as what he does ''
Well blow me. Who would have thought it.
Cat Slayer says
''Eck is good as what he does ''
Well blow me. Who would have thought it.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:42pm Wed 7 May 08
[quote][bold]Van Helsing - Nat Slayer[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Wardog[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Van Helsing - Nat Slayer[/bold] wrote: Good point Mike -Edinburgh. But the fact is that Fat Eck won't hold a referendum until he thinks he can win - otherwise he's finished. So when will that be - is it open-ended 3, 5 10 years? I have nothing to fear
Politics
INDEX
Comment | Read Comments (343)
