SNP government budget passed
The SNP's budget was tonight passed after it won the backing of MSPs at Holyrood.
The nationalist administration's first budget was voted through by 64 votes to one against with 60 abstentions after the Nationalists won the support of the Tories and independent Margo MacDonald.
The result removes the prospect of a snap election with First Minister Alex Salmond having previously threatened to quit and go to the country if it was not passed.
Finance secretary John Swinney opened the crunch debate by pulling two rabbits out of the hat - a promise of bigger than planned business rate cuts to woo the Tories, and an extra £4 million in bus grants to entice the Greens.
He told Holyrood: "Any member voting against this budget is sending a message to their constituents that they want Scottish taxpayers burdened with a record tax increase with the pain felt by tens of thousands of Scotland's most vulnerable pensioners.
Labour's Iain Gray branded First Minister Alex Salmond's threats to quit if the budget was refused as an "unedifying pantomime" and "bravado" and said that deals had already been done to secure the budget's approval.
The Tories Derek Brownlee said: "Today is historic - not because of what they (the SNP) have done, but because it marks the final humiliation of the Scottish Labour Party."
For the Lib Dems, Tavish Scott called the budget a "Con-Nat" budget.
And he described Mr Salmond's threat to resign if the budget was not passed as being "a landmark strop".
Mr Swinney later said that the amendment from the Labour party posed the government "no difficulties whatsoever" and encouraged his SNP colleagues to back it.
"In the spirit of consensus and in the spirit of Mr Kerr's remarks to me just a moment ago, that this was my opportunity to raise myself above party advantage, I dutifully raise myself up to my full six feet and courageously invite the Labour Party to reciprocate my kind desire and wish to support their amendment - as long as they support my budget at stage 3," he said.
He said it was "absurd" for Labour to put forward amendments to the budget in the Finance Committee which affect 1% of its spending and failing in this, vote against the remaining 99% in a "hissy fit".
© All rights reserved. Reproduction in whole or in part without
permission is prohibited.
Posted by: Observer, Glasgow on 5:46pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Who was the one against ? Did someone press the wrong button ?
Who was the one against ? Did someone press the wrong button ?
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 5:47pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I suspect Mrs Jim Sillars.
I suspect Mrs Jim Sillars.
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 5:49pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Meant to explain, the new Mrs Jim Sillars used to be called Ms Wendy somebody ... now known as the Scottish Fugitive - TV series to follow.
Meant to explain, the new Mrs Jim Sillars used to be called Ms Wendy somebody ... now known as the Scottish Fugitive - TV series to follow.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 5:50pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[bold]Sixty abstentions - sixty MSPs unable to represent their voters.[/bold]
Sixty abstentions - sixty MSPs unable to represent their voters.
Posted by: Supershug, Eaglesham on 5:52pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Game, set and match to Alex Salmond on that one.
A Labour party going into an election with a prospective First Minister facing the possibility of a criminal conviction and a shambolic LibDem party with a leader whose increasingly personal attacks are losing the party both its credibility and its "friendly face" clearly put the frighteners on them both. That's without going into the implications on council tax etc.
However, both have now taken the most cowardly of all positions - abstaining and yet sniping at an outcome they did not have the courage to prevent.
Salmond's stature continues to grow (and no, I have never been an SNP member).
This is a day with profound implications for the Scottish Government. Far from being hamstrung by being a minority party, Salmond's brave decision leaves him more powerful against opposition parties in disarray.
Game, set and match to Alex Salmond on that one.
A Labour party going into an election with a prospective First Minister facing the possibility of a criminal conviction and a shambolic LibDem party with a leader whose increasingly personal attacks are losing the party both its credibility and its "friendly face" clearly put the frighteners on them both. That's without going into the implications on council tax etc.
However, both have now taken the most cowardly of all positions - abstaining and yet sniping at an outcome they did not have the courage to prevent.
Salmond's stature continues to grow (and no, I have never been an SNP member).
This is a day with profound implications for the Scottish Government. Far from being hamstrung by being a minority party, Salmond's brave decision leaves him more powerful against opposition parties in disarray.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 5:53pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote]Finance secretary John Swinney opened the crunch debate by pulling two rabbits out of the hat - a promise of bigger than planned business rate cuts to woo the Tories, and an extra £4 million in bus grants to entice the Greens[/quote] Smart move, Vatman.
Finance secretary John Swinney opened the crunch debate by pulling two rabbits out of the hat - a promise of bigger than planned business rate cuts to woo the Tories, and an extra £4 million in bus grants to entice the Greens
Smart move, Vatman.
Posted by: Burd Tina on 5:54pm Wed 6 Feb 08
It's funny it was just one person who voted no. Maybe the media will find out who it was.
It's funny it was just one person who voted no. Maybe the media will find out who it was.
Posted by: Alex Porter, Madrid on 5:55pm Wed 6 Feb 08
After all that disingenuous bluster, they abstained. Pathetic.
After all that disingenuous bluster, they abstained. Pathetic.
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 5:55pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Now, properly on topic. I met Annabel Goldie before the election and she was clear about the Tory stance. No coalition with anybody but will fight in parliament on an issue by issue basis. They have been as good as their word.
However, she should need see the folly of her party's ways with the Wendy-inspired "save the Union" huddle, muddle or guddle.
Ms Goldie, I am not the first to say it, but I suggest you ditch the Unionist part of your party's identity and form a completely independent Scottish Conservative Party. The gemme's a bogey for the Union so get out now and one day your party could be in government. Certainly that will happen before NuLabour ever get back in.
Now, properly on topic. I met Annabel Goldie before the election and she was clear about the Tory stance. No coalition with anybody but will fight in parliament on an issue by issue basis. They have been as good as their word.
However, she should need see the folly of her party's ways with the Wendy-inspired "save the Union" huddle, muddle or guddle.
Ms Goldie, I am not the first to say it, but I suggest you ditch the Unionist part of your party's identity and form a completely independent Scottish Conservative Party. The gemme's a bogey for the Union so get out now and one day your party could be in government. Certainly that will happen before NuLabour ever get back in.
Posted by: subrosa on 5:55pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I read in the Scotsman that Margo voted 'for' so no idea as yet who voted 'no'.
I read in the Scotsman that Margo voted 'for' so no idea as yet who voted 'no'.
Posted by: dws on 5:56pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote]Labour's Iain Gray branded First Minister Alex Salmond's threats to quit if the budget was refused as an "unedifying pantomime" and "bravado" and said that deals had already been done to secure the budget's approval.[/quote]
[quote]For the Lib Dems, Tavish Scott called the budget a "Con-Nat" budget.
And he described Mr Salmond's threat to resign if the budget was not passed as being "a landmark strop".[/quote]
Bitter...bitter...bi
tter.
Labour's Iain Gray branded First Minister Alex Salmond's threats to quit if the budget was refused as an "unedifying pantomime" and "bravado" and said that deals had already been done to secure the budget's approval.
For the Lib Dems, Tavish Scott called the budget a "Con-Nat" budget.
And he described Mr Salmond's threat to resign if the budget was not passed as being "a landmark strop".
Bitter...bitter...bi
tter.
Posted by: Observer, Glasgow on 5:57pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I think someone pressed the wrong button. Seriously.
I think someone pressed the wrong button. Seriously.
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 5:58pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Abstaining is cowardly, voting "No" is brave. So will that one person now show further bravery and step forward to be interviewed by Glenn Campbell?
Abstaining is cowardly, voting "No" is brave. So will that one person now show further bravery and step forward to be interviewed by Glenn Campbell?
Posted by: Burd Tina on 5:59pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I only saw the end of the debate, but I thought John Swinney was impressive. He comes over really well in the Scottish Parliament.
I only saw the end of the debate, but I thought John Swinney was impressive. He comes over really well in the Scottish Parliament.
Posted by: MtnKat on 6:00pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Observer
Whose sweaty paw slipped onto the NO button? Case of nerves?
Observer
Whose sweaty paw slipped onto the NO button? Case of nerves?
Posted by: Alex Porter, Madrid on 6:01pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Waiting to see the balanced and principled Scottish poltical journalists telling us that Salmond outfoxed Labour and the Libs. 'Humiliation for Labour Opposition' will sound the headlines.
Who is Robbie Dunwoodie kidding?
Waiting to see the balanced and principled Scottish poltical journalists telling us that Salmond outfoxed Labour and the Libs. 'Humiliation for Labour Opposition' will sound the headlines.
Who is Robbie Dunwoodie kidding?
Posted by: Morag, Peeblesshire on 6:04pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Stoppit, I have to get home and within sight of [italic]Reporting Scotland[/italic].
Stoppit, I have to get home and within sight of
Reporting Scotland.
Posted by: subrosa on 6:05pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Posted by: Burd Tina on 5:59pm today
Aye Tina he's found his niche. He's always been a man who enjoys detail and a good argument :)
Posted by: Burd Tina on 5:59pm today
Aye Tina he's found his niche. He's always been a man who enjoys detail and a good argument :)
Posted by: Melanthios on 6:06pm Wed 6 Feb 08
It was probably Foulkes. He saw too many buttons......hic.
It was probably Foulkes. He saw too many buttons......hic.
Posted by: Melanthios on 6:07pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Or maybe it was Salmond HOPING to get another election.
Or maybe it was Salmond HOPING to get another election.
Posted by: Mike Simpson, Glasgow on 6:08pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond) in hock to Annabelle Goldie and the Scottish Conservatives. What a way they have come!
AT least, now we know why the Nats have historically enjoyed the title "Tartan Tories", as far as I can see not much seperates the Cons and the SNP.
ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!!
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond) in hock to Annabelle Goldie and the Scottish Conservatives. What a way they have come!
AT least, now we know why the Nats have historically enjoyed the title "Tartan Tories", as far as I can see not much seperates the Cons and the SNP.
ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!!
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 6:09pm Wed 6 Feb 08
You heard it here first ;-
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 12:22am today
From the article;- Last night one senior Labour MP branded the First Minister's ultimatum as "grandstanding", claiming his threat to quit was only made in the full knowledge that sufficient support for the Budget plans had already been gained from Opposition groups Note the slab spokesman said opposition groups While later in the article this appears;- while Labour, which has opposed the Budget " up to now," refused to comment on the election brinkmanship. The story as I've just heard it goes like this Slab approached the SNP yesterday/ today and said they'll back the budget IF the SNP accept slabs program of apprentiseships The SNP yes we would like to support this as a worthwhile proposal, But we have no more cash to offer So an agreement is reach whereby the apprentises scheme can go ahead in the future Sorted------- No news leaks out that slab are preparing a press release saying that slab have snatched back the agenda-- Enter AS AND MAKES HIS BACK ME OR SACK ME Speech thus forcing slabs hand to do just that and keep the SNP agenda. The SNP have made the concession ------- the ball is now in slabs court (no pun intended wendy) If slab don't want an election, then they have a way out by supporting the apprentices
You heard it here first ;-
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 12:22am today
From the article;- Last night one senior Labour MP branded the First Minister's ultimatum as "grandstanding", claiming his threat to quit was only made in the full knowledge that sufficient support for the Budget plans had already been gained from Opposition groups Note the slab spokesman said opposition groups While later in the article this appears;- while Labour, which has opposed the Budget " up to now," refused to comment on the election brinkmanship. The story as I've just heard it goes like this Slab approached the SNP yesterday/ today and said they'll back the budget IF the SNP accept slabs program of apprentiseships The SNP yes we would like to support this as a worthwhile proposal, But we have no more cash to offer So an agreement is reach whereby the apprentises scheme can go ahead in the future Sorted------- No news leaks out that slab are preparing a press release saying that slab have snatched back the agenda-- Enter AS AND MAKES HIS BACK ME OR SACK ME Speech thus forcing slabs hand to do just that and keep the SNP agenda. The SNP have made the concession ------- the ball is now in slabs court (no pun intended wendy) If slab don't want an election, then they have a way out by supporting the apprentices
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 6:11pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote]Waiting to see the balanced and principled Scottish poltical journalists telling us that Salmond outfoxed Labour and the Libs.[/quote]Certainly, "SNP Budget Passed" errs on the, erm, prosaic.
How about, "[bold]First SNP Budget Passed In Historic Debate[/bold] "?
To congratulatory?
The word does have "Tory" in it so the Herald has no need to worry about accusations of partisan reporting.
Waiting to see the balanced and principled Scottish poltical journalists telling us that Salmond outfoxed Labour and the Libs.
Certainly, "SNP Budget Passed" errs on the, erm, prosaic.
How about, "
First SNP Budget Passed In Historic Debate "?
To congratulatory?
The word does have "Tory" in it so the Herald has no need to worry about accusations of partisan reporting.
Posted by: Jimbo on 6:12pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote][bold]MtnKat[/bold] wrote:
Observer Whose sweaty paw slipped onto the NO button? Case of nerves?[/quote] I think I just heard on the news that it was a Labour MSP, Cathy something or other.
Why didn't the Labour lot vote for their own amendment?
[quote]He told Holyrood: "Any member voting against this budget is sending a message to their constituents that they want Scottish taxpayers burdened with a record tax increase with the pain felt by tens of thousands of Scotland's most vulnerable pensioners.[/quote]
I reckon he had them over a barrel.
MtnKat wrote:
Observer Whose sweaty paw slipped onto the NO button? Case of nerves?
I think I just heard on the news that it was a Labour MSP, Cathy something or other.
Why didn't the Labour lot vote for their own amendment?
He told Holyrood: "Any member voting against this budget is sending a message to their constituents that they want Scottish taxpayers burdened with a record tax increase with the pain felt by tens of thousands of Scotland's most vulnerable pensioners.
I reckon he had them over a barrel.
Posted by: megz, glasgow on 6:12pm Wed 6 Feb 08
it was cathy craigy that voted no
it was cathy craigy that voted no
Posted by: Arnold Codger, Glasgow on 6:15pm Wed 6 Feb 08
It was Cathie Craigie from Cumbernauld who voted No.
60 abstentions, says it all really, it just shows how progressive the labour and lib dem pack government really was.
Was Salmonds threat to resign, which was never going to happen because the deal was already done and Labour would never take the risk of being well defeated in an election, meant to be a hint to Wendy. Maybe it was an expression of his committment.
Whatever it was i don't like the precedent it sets, its meant to be an all-or-nothing gamble and i think it may come back to haunt him.
It was Cathie Craigie from Cumbernauld who voted No.
60 abstentions, says it all really, it just shows how progressive the labour and lib dem pack government really was.
Was Salmonds threat to resign, which was never going to happen because the deal was already done and Labour would never take the risk of being well defeated in an election, meant to be a hint to Wendy. Maybe it was an expression of his committment.
Whatever it was i don't like the precedent it sets, its meant to be an all-or-nothing gamble and i think it may come back to haunt him.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 6:16pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Pass The Mike - It's My Turn To Speak[quote]Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond)[/quote] Groan.
There's no need for the corny "aka" crap after "Wee Eck."
We know to whom you refer and we know you are keen to have us believe you are capable of complicated thought.
Pass The Mike - It's My Turn To Speak
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond)
Groan.
There's no need for the corny "aka" crap after "Wee Eck."
We know to whom you refer and we know you are keen to have us believe you are capable of complicated thought.
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 6:18pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote][bold]Mike Simpson[/bold] wrote:
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond) in hock to Annabelle Goldie and the Scottish Conservatives. What a way they have come!
AT least, now we know why the Nats have historically enjoyed the title "Tartan Tories", as far as I can see not much seperates the Cons and the SNP.
ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!! [/quote] Mike, your surely mistaking Labour for the Tories, can you even tell the difference at the UK level anymore..... the Uk electorate surely can't.....
Mike Simpson wrote:
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond) in hock to Annabelle Goldie and the Scottish Conservatives. What a way they have come!
AT least, now we know why the Nats have historically enjoyed the title "Tartan Tories", as far as I can see not much seperates the Cons and the SNP.
ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!!
Mike, your surely mistaking Labour for the Tories, can you even tell the difference at the UK level anymore..... the Uk electorate surely can't.....
Posted by: David Alexander on 6:20pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Just watching the main news on the BBC.
The halftime trailer for Reporting Scotland will be featuring, wait for it...
1. The rats on St Kilda.
2. Dundee United.
3. Erm, thats it!
Ho, ho ho!
Just watching the main news on the BBC.
The halftime trailer for Reporting Scotland will be featuring, wait for it...
1. The rats on St Kilda.
2. Dundee United.
3. Erm, thats it!
Ho, ho ho!
Posted by: Jimbo on 6:21pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Mike Simpson,
[quote]Nice to see [bold]Wee[/bold] Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond)[/quote]
You've obviously never met the man.
How sad is the Labour/Liberal 'can't-do' brigade?
Mike Simpson,
Nice to see Wee Eck (a.k.a Alex Salmond)
You've obviously never met the man.
How sad is the Labour/Liberal 'can't-do' brigade?
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 6:22pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Another Old Codger[quote]Was Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff[/quote] No.
You credit him with too much insight.
He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power.
He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them.
And it worked.
Another Old Codger
Was Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff
No.
You credit him with too much insight.
He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power.
He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them.
And it worked.
Posted by: David Alexander on 6:24pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Mike Simpson
[quote]ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!![/quote]
Yes, Labour and the LibDems took a separate bus from the Tories on their way down to London for their wee conversation.
Mike Simpson
ANY other self respecting party would be doing their damndest to distance themselves from the revolting Tories after all the damage they done to jobs and cuts in our vital services, or do they have short memories??!!!
Yes, Labour and the LibDems took a separate bus from the Tories on their way down to London for their wee conversation.
Posted by: Astonished, Inverclyde on 6:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I posted earlier about the palpable fear in the Labour postings. Delighted with the outcome - Historic and good for Scotland.
Well done Mr Swinney !
I heard the BBC Radio Scotland interview with Mr Swinney while driving home, he was being interviewed by an obviously disgruntled pro-Labour hackette. Her final comment was shocking!
I posted earlier about the palpable fear in the Labour postings. Delighted with the outcome - Historic and good for Scotland.
Well done Mr Swinney !
I heard the BBC Radio Scotland interview with Mr Swinney while driving home, he was being interviewed by an obviously disgruntled pro-Labour hackette. Her final comment was shocking!
Posted by: David Alexander on 6:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Astonished
What was her comment?
Astonished
What was her comment?
Posted by: pencildick on 6:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
What difference does it make who voted no.
The budget has passed.
Stop the witch hunting and the gloating
be happy.
Well done the Scottish "minority" Government.
What difference does it make who voted no.
The budget has passed.
Stop the witch hunting and the gloating
be happy.
Well done the Scottish "minority" Government.
Posted by: Scunnert, Travelling in Nihlon on 6:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
DISAPPOINTED!!!
I wanted an election! Labour and Libdem windbags have no bottle!
DISAPPOINTED!!!
I wanted an election! Labour and Libdem windbags have no bottle!
Posted by: scappaflow, RoS on 6:28pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Labour are a joke of an opposition party. As are the Libs. To criticise Salmond for his threat to resign, and then not even vote in the budget is fairly hypocritical.
Decisions are made by those who show up and Labour and the Lib Dems have shown themselves to be not even capable of that.
It seems that the only reason they voted against the budget was because it was an SNP budget and they thought it would be a laugh if they couldn't get it through. It seems everyone is now laughing at them.
Labour are a joke of an opposition party. As are the Libs. To criticise Salmond for his threat to resign, and then not even vote in the budget is fairly hypocritical.
Decisions are made by those who show up and Labour and the Lib Dems have shown themselves to be not even capable of that.
It seems that the only reason they voted against the budget was because it was an SNP budget and they thought it would be a laugh if they couldn't get it through. It seems everyone is now laughing at them.
Posted by: Astonished, Inverclyde on 6:39pm Wed 6 Feb 08
The interview was conducted along Labor lines, Mr Salmond grandstanding etc...
Mr Swinney explained about conceding to the Labour request for more apprenticeships, then Labour failing to support the budget. He explained that Labour MSPs should understand that Scotland demanded conciliatory and understanding politics from all parties. Finally he said Labour still don't get this. (This is the gist of the interview - it is not verbatim)
The Hackette signed off with a sneer "Thank you Mr. Swinney - Conciliatory and understanding to the last !".
Completely unacceptable.
The interview was conducted along Labor lines, Mr Salmond grandstanding etc...
Mr Swinney explained about conceding to the Labour request for more apprenticeships, then Labour failing to support the budget. He explained that Labour MSPs should understand that Scotland demanded conciliatory and understanding politics from all parties. Finally he said Labour still don't get this. (This is the gist of the interview - it is not verbatim)
The Hackette signed off with a sneer "Thank you Mr. Swinney - Conciliatory and understanding to the last !".
Completely unacceptable.
Posted by: Astonished, Inverclyde on 6:40pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Mr Alexander ,
Hope this helps
Mr Alexander ,
Hope this helps
Posted by: David Alexander on 6:48pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Astonished
Thanks, and I would agree that it is unacceptable.
Last week the BBC commentator (John Barnes?) in the Hearts cup tie, on seeing Alex Salmond in the stand said "Its good to see him doing something useful for a change".
Their disdain knows no bounds.
Astonished
Thanks, and I would agree that it is unacceptable.
Last week the BBC commentator (John Barnes?) in the Hearts cup tie, on seeing Alex Salmond in the stand said "Its good to see him doing something useful for a change".
Their disdain knows no bounds.
Posted by: Exiled Aussie, Banff on 7:02pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
Another Old Codger[quote]Was Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff[/quote] No. You credit him with too much insight. He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power. He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them. And it worked. [/quote] Utter piffle!
Diminutive knew in advance that his Conservative chums would back him (ditto Greens) so his threat of resigning was just another example of the man's unbearble arrogance and showboating..
After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?
Now for sure we have the Tartan Tories lined up with thealternative Tories - as most on the left predicted decades ago !
Los Angeles wrote:
Another Old CodgerWas Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff
No. You credit him with too much insight. He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power. He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them. And it worked.
Utter piffle!
Diminutive knew in advance that his Conservative chums would back him (ditto Greens) so his threat of resigning was just another example of the man's unbearble arrogance and showboating..
After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?
Now for sure we have the Tartan Tories lined up with thealternative Tories - as most on the left predicted decades ago !
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 7:02pm Wed 6 Feb 08
david on a BBC Commentator[quote]Last week the BBC commentator (John Barnes?) in the Hearts cup tie, on seeing Alex Salmond in the stand said "Its good to see him doing something useful for a change".[/quote]Jeez.
If true, that remark ought to get him reprimanded by the BBC.
david on a BBC Commentator
Last week the BBC commentator (John Barnes?) in the Hearts cup tie, on seeing Alex Salmond in the stand said "Its good to see him doing something useful for a change".
Jeez.
If true, that remark ought to get him reprimanded by the BBC.
Posted by: Neil, Aberdeenshire on 7:03pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote]"Today is historic - not because of what they (the SNP) have done, but because it marks the final humiliation of the Scottish Labour Party."[/quote]
Indeed.
Except I doubt it will be their final humiliation; that will come when they are reduced to single figures in the Parliament after the next election. That will also complete their transition to the New Tory Party as they follow the path poineered by the Tories 20 years ago.
"Today is historic - not because of what they (the SNP) have done, but because it marks the final humiliation of the Scottish Labour Party."
Indeed.
Except I doubt it will be their final humiliation; that will come when they are reduced to single figures in the Parliament after the next election. That will also complete their transition to the New Tory Party as they follow the path poineered by the Tories 20 years ago.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 7:04pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Fake Aussie Troll[quote]Utter piffle![/quote] You are the master at piffle .. and fakery.
Fake Aussie Troll
Utter piffle!
You are the master at piffle .. and fakery.
Posted by: Tam, Glasgow on 7:05pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Posted by: Tam, Glasgow on 9:28am today
This is Alex playing hardball. John Swinney will [bold]probably[/bold] make sufficient concessions to get the Greens and Margo on board so that he will [bold]probably[/bold] command a majority and the budget will go through. Labour wont be sure of this though. Alex is daring labour to vote against and force Alex to stand down. It is unlikely that an alternative First Minister would get a majority in Parliament so an election would follow. This is the last thing that labour want so they may be forced into abstaining.
This is Alex playing hardball.
John Swinney will probably make sufficient concessions to get the Greens and Margo on board so that he will probably command a majority and the budget will go through. Labour wont be sure of this though.
Alex is daring labour to vote against and force Alex to stand down. It is unlikely that an alternative First Minister would get a majority in Parliament so an election would follow.
This is the last thing that labour want so they may be forced into abstaining.
[bold]Job done Alex.[/bold]
Posted by: Tam, Glasgow on 9:28am today
This is Alex playing hardball. John Swinney will
probably make sufficient concessions to get the Greens and Margo on board so that he will
probably command a majority and the budget will go through. Labour wont be sure of this though. Alex is daring labour to vote against and force Alex to stand down. It is unlikely that an alternative First Minister would get a majority in Parliament so an election would follow. This is the last thing that labour want so they may be forced into abstaining.
This is Alex playing hardball.
John Swinney will probably make sufficient concessions to get the Greens and Margo on board so that he will probably command a majority and the budget will go through. Labour wont be sure of this though.
Alex is daring labour to vote against and force Alex to stand down. It is unlikely that an alternative First Minister would get a majority in Parliament so an election would follow.
This is the last thing that labour want so they may be forced into abstaining.
Job done Alex. Posted by: Blarney, Edinburgh on 7:07pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Well done Alex and John, brilliant stuff. As for LabLib, what a bunch of spineless sods. An exceptionaly large yellow stripe up their backs.
The Tories did their job well, pity they don't ditch the unionist mantle.
Happy days!!
Well done Alex and John, brilliant stuff. As for LabLib, what a bunch of spineless sods. An exceptionaly large yellow stripe up their backs.
The Tories did their job well, pity they don't ditch the unionist mantle.
Happy days!!
Posted by: Jimbo on 7:09pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Hi Banffer,
[quote]After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?[/quote]
It's called consensus politics. Something minority governments have to participate in.
What's with the juvenile nicknames? Have you not yet rid yourself of a playground mentality?
Hi Banffer,
After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?
It's called consensus politics. Something minority governments have to participate in.
What's with the juvenile nicknames? Have you not yet rid yourself of a playground mentality?
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 7:17pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote][bold]pencildick[/bold] wrote:
What difference does it make who voted no. The budget has passed. Stop the witch hunting and the gloating be happy. Well done the Scottish "minority" Government.[/quote] You have a point of course, but I think we're entitled to have a laugh. Does Cathy Craigie have ambitions to take over from Wendy? Why no unity in the "crumbling party"?
As I say, you make a good point and after today let's get back to the long and hard work to recover this country from 300 years of misrule.
No sign of "Proud to be Scottish" yet. (He or she managed plenty of posts on another thread this morning). Still, Mike Simpson is back.
The SNP government have not been distracted by the Wendy shenanigans so let's help them keep their eyes on the ball.
pencildick wrote:
What difference does it make who voted no. The budget has passed. Stop the witch hunting and the gloating be happy. Well done the Scottish "minority" Government.
You have a point of course, but I think we're entitled to have a laugh. Does Cathy Craigie have ambitions to take over from Wendy? Why no unity in the "crumbling party"?
As I say, you make a good point and after today let's get back to the long and hard work to recover this country from 300 years of misrule.
No sign of "Proud to be Scottish" yet. (He or she managed plenty of posts on another thread this morning). Still, Mike Simpson is back.
The SNP government have not been distracted by the Wendy shenanigans so let's help them keep their eyes on the ball.
Posted by: Jock in the Box, edinburgh on 7:23pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I'm fairly confident that Ian Gray's response of accusing the SNP of a pre arranged stage managed vote between the SNP and the Tories is in fact a camouflage for what Labour have in fact done.
They were ordered to abstain from LONDON and Cathie Craigies No is probably the only one vote they dared to risk and a pre prepared response to the accusation of Westminster style whip being employed here. Ian Gray probably thinks he has been clever here.
It might fool Cathie Craigie's supporters around Kylsyth,but I doubt Scotland will swallow this crap.
[bold]LABOUR RAN AWAY SCARED OF THE OUTCOME[/bold]
Labour wear [bold]Yellow and Red[/bold] rosettes and the [bold]Yellow[/bold] just became the dominant colour.
I'm fairly confident that Ian Gray's response of accusing the SNP of a pre arranged stage managed vote between the SNP and the Tories is in fact a camouflage for what Labour have in fact done.
They were ordered to abstain from LONDON and Cathie Craigies No is probably the only one vote they dared to risk and a pre prepared response to the accusation of Westminster style whip being employed here. Ian Gray probably thinks he has been clever here.
It might fool Cathie Craigie's supporters around Kylsyth,but I doubt Scotland will swallow this crap.
LABOUR RAN AWAY SCARED OF THE OUTCOME
Labour wear
Yellow and Red rosettes and the
Yellow just became the dominant colour.
Posted by: Observer, Glasgow on 7:24pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Hi Jimbo - good luck trying to persuade Aussie of anything he doesn't even know about the Scotland Act. Anyway what we have seen is concensus Government in action whether Labour and the Libs like it or not. Annabelle Goldie has got her head around it just fine. I'm an old leftie but I don't object to what's happened today. Tartan Tories is just sooooo last Century. This is a new politics, it's just a shame that some of us have yet to catch up.
Hi Jimbo - good luck trying to persuade Aussie of anything he doesn't even know about the Scotland Act. Anyway what we have seen is concensus Government in action whether Labour and the Libs like it or not. Annabelle Goldie has got her head around it just fine. I'm an old leftie but I don't object to what's happened today. Tartan Tories is just sooooo last Century. This is a new politics, it's just a shame that some of us have yet to catch up.
Posted by: Midget Gem, Scotland on 7:25pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Astonished, Inverclyde on 6:26pm today
I was furious with the tone of this interview as well and posted this on the other budget thread.
Oh dearie me , I see the successful passing of the budget has irritated Ruth Davidson of BBC Radio Scotland's Newsdrive.
Listen again to her interview with John Swinney at 1715 anyone who wants to hear some Wark style contempt for an SNP minister fearlessly employed by a BBC reporter. It's classic stuff.
Well done to the SNP but I wish you'd be more considerate, you've ruined Ruth's afternoon and she's probably going to have to stop for some Rennies on the way home.
Astonished, Inverclyde on 6:26pm today
I was furious with the tone of this interview as well and posted this on the other budget thread.
Oh dearie me , I see the successful passing of the budget has irritated Ruth Davidson of BBC Radio Scotland's Newsdrive.
Listen again to her interview with John Swinney at 1715 anyone who wants to hear some Wark style contempt for an SNP minister fearlessly employed by a BBC reporter. It's classic stuff.
Well done to the SNP but I wish you'd be more considerate, you've ruined Ruth's afternoon and she's probably going to have to stop for some Rennies on the way home.
Posted by: Observer, Glasgow on 7:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Dammit I heard it was a Cathie that pressed the wrong button and hoped it was Jamieson !
Dammit I heard it was a Cathie that pressed the wrong button and hoped it was Jamieson !
Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 7:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
[quote][bold]Exiled Aussie[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
Another Old Codger[quote]Was Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff[/quote] No. You credit him with too much insight. He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power. He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them. And it worked. [/quote] Utter piffle!
Diminutive knew in advance that his Conservative chums would back him (ditto Greens) so his threat of resigning was just another example of the man's unbearble arrogance and showboating..
After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?
Now for sure we have the Tartan Tories lined up with thealternative Tories - as most on the left predicted decades ago ![/quote] Which one of these [bold]DON'T[/bold] you support Banffer?
[bold]
A FREEZE IN COUNCIL TAX (Soon to be Local income Tax)
GREATER LOCAL GOVERNMENT ACCOUNTABILITY
ADDITIONAL POLICE OFFICERS
CUTTING BUSINESS RATES
A NEW DRUG REHABILITATION POLICY
SMALLER MORE EFFICIENT GOVERNMENT
RECORD SUPPORT FOR LOCAL BUS SERVICES
CARBON INDEX TO ALL FUTURE BUDGETS[/bold]
Are you so blinkered that New Labour are still the Socialist Labour you probably supported back in the day that you can't even raise your eyes to see the historic transformative moves that this budget is heralding...... [bold]Welcome to Scotland 2007[/bold]
Exiled Aussie wrote:
Los Angeles wrote:
Another Old CodgerWas Salmonds threat to resign .. a bluff
No. You credit him with too much insight. He had no reason to believe other than told - over and over again - that the opposition would gang up on the SNP to wipe out the budget. But he knew what he saw: Labour in complete disarray, leaderless, under threat of court action, the Lib-Dems recoiling from voter disdain because they missed an opportunity to share power. He used their confusion and disorder as a weapon against them. And it worked.
Utter piffle!
Diminutive knew in advance that his Conservative chums would back him (ditto Greens) so his threat of resigning was just another example of the man's unbearble arrogance and showboating..
After all, why should Ms Goldie and her friends NOT support the NUTS when the latter were giving in to their every demand so that the man, Little Fish, the Swindler and Co could cling to power ?
Now for sure we have the Tartan Tories lined up with thealternative Tories - as most on the left predicted decades ago !
Which one of these
DON'T you support Banffer?
A FREEZE IN COUNCIL TAX (Soon to be Local income Tax)
GREATER LOCAL GOVERNMENT ACCOUNTABILITY
ADDITIONAL POLICE OFFICERS
CUTTING BUSINESS RATES
A NEW DRUG REHABILITATION POLICY
SMALLER MORE EFFICIENT GOVERNMENT
RECORD SUPPORT FOR LOCAL BUS SERVICES
CARBON INDEX TO ALL FUTURE BUDGETS
Are you so blinkered that New Labour are still the Socialist Labour you probably supported back in the day that you can't even raise your eyes to see the historic transformative moves that this budget is heralding......
Welcome to Scotland 2007
Posted by: Grahamski, Falkirk on 7:26pm Wed 6 Feb 08
The important thing for Scotland now that the budget has finally been set is that the SNP realise that they have been entrusted with the health, education, transport amongst others, all very important areas of Scottish life. Please, for the good of the country, make the resignation stunt the last political posturing Mr Salmond indulges in. The role of the FM is too important to ignore - cheap political pointscoring must be put on hold, the Scottish people deserve more and the party caught indulging in partisan politics will pay dearly at the polls.
The important thing for Scotland now that the budget has finally been set is that the SNP realise that they have been entrusted with the health, education, transport amongst others, all very important areas of Scottish life. Please, for the good of the country, make the resignation stunt the last political posturing Mr Salmond indulges in. The role of the FM is too important to ignore - cheap political pointscoring must be put on hold, the Scottish people deserve more and the party caught indulging in partisan politics will pay dearly at the polls.
Posted by: Jock in the Box, edinburgh on 7:28pm Wed 6 Feb 08
In the words of the late Oliver Brown
[bold]A shiver ran along the Labour benches ,looking for a spine to run up[/bold] !
SOME THINGS NEVER CHANGE
In the words of the late Oliver Brown
A shiver ran along the Labour benches ,looking for a spine to run up !
SOME THINGS NEVER CHANGE
Posted by: Harry Shanks, Rutherglen on 7:31pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Has anybody else noticed a number of BBC so-called journalists routinely refer to the First Minister as "Salmond" in their reports and discussions on the likes of Poltics Scotland? If not, just watch and take note - you'll find I'm correct.
Messrs Alexander, Stephen, Goldie et al, are all accorded a christian name.
Now I realise this isn't a big legal point - but it is indicative of an extremely selective lack of respect.
On the subject of AS threatened resignation - I wouldn't trust the Tories (or the Lib Dems or Labour ) to actually deliver [bold]anything[/bold] they'd allegedly already agreed on. This was, in my opinion, sensible "insurance" by AS and not posturing or grandstanding as has been suggested.
Has anybody else noticed a number of BBC so-called journalists routinely refer to the First Minister as "Salmond" in their reports and discussions on the likes of Poltics Scotland? If not, just watch and take note - you'll find I'm correct.
Messrs Alexander, Stephen, Goldie et al, are all accorded a christian name.
Now I realise this isn't a big legal point - but it is indicative of an extremely selective lack of respect.
On the subject of AS threatened resignation - I wouldn't trust the Tories (or the Lib Dems or Labour ) to actually deliver
anything they'd allegedly already agreed on. This was, in my opinion, sensible "insurance" by AS and not posturing or grandstanding as has been suggested.
Posted by: Tam, Glasgow on 7:32pm Wed 6 Feb 08
I suspect that Alex knew all along that he had it in the bag,
[bold]But Labour and the Lib Dems didn't.[/bold]
It was clear that the Tories were on board.
I suspect that Margo was in on the whole thing but fooled the Lib Labs into thinking she was holding out for more Lothian Health money. Well played Margo. Thereby casting doubt on the majority and putting the fear of death into Labour and Lib Dems of humiliation at the polls.
All John Swinney had to do was to provide a few more 'routemasters' to get Harvie et al to abstain and he was home and dry.
Despite Labour and Lib Dems voting against the budget at stage 1 and criticising all the concessions made they did not have the bottle to vote against.
I suspect that Alex knew all along that he had it in the bag,
But Labour and the Lib Dems didn't.
It was clear that the Tories were on board.
I suspect that Margo was in on the whole thing but fooled the Lib Labs into thinking she was holding out for more Lothian Health money. Well played Margo. Thereby casting doubt on the majority and putting the fear of death into Labour and Lib Dems of humiliation at the polls.
All John Swinney had to do was to provide a few more 'routemasters' to get Harvie et al to abstain and he was home and dry.
Despite Labour and Lib Dems voting against the budget at stage 1 and criticising all the concessions made they did not have the bottle to vote against.
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 7:33pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Ha ha ha grahamski's still sh 1 ting himself something else forces a confidence vote !
Ha ha ha grahamski's still sh 1 ting himself something else forces a confidence vote !
Posted by: richard, West Lothian on 7:36pm Wed 6 Feb 08
So budget over, no word from the electoral commission?
So budget over, no word from the electoral commission?
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 7:40pm Wed 6 Feb 08
Grahamski Humbled[quote]cheap political pointscoring must be put on hold[/quote] Or put another way:
We, the opposition, the dissenters, the dissemblers, the buttered ar*se brigade, the war mongers, and the lickspittle bottom feeders, have been humiliated by the institution of real political dedication and acumen employed not for personal preferment or a few back-pocket bawbees, but rather in serving a fine, noble political cause ... please don't laugh at us too loudly.
Grahamski Humbled
cheap political pointscoring must be put on hold
Or put another way:
We, the opposition, the dissenters, the dissemblers, the buttered ar*se brigade, the war mongers, and the lickspittle bottom feeders, have been humiliated by the institution of real political dedication and acumen employed not for personal preferment or a few back-pocket bawbees, but rather in serving a fine, noble political cause ... please don't laugh at us too loudly.
News
INDEX
Comment | Read Comments (192)
