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Salmond moves to block new ID cards in Scotland
Alex Salmond's government is on a collision course with Westminster over the introduction of ID cards, making clear that it will seek to stop a "compulsory scheme by stealth" operating north of the border.
The Herald was told the First Minister had "serious concerns" over the policy's harmful effects on civil liberties while producing no tangible benefit to security. Enforcement by London was likened to the political storm caused by the imposition of the poll tax by Margaret Thatcher.
Justice Secretary Kenny MacAskill is to make urgent
representations to Jacqui Smith, the Home Secretary, expressing Holyrood's "vehement opposition" to Gordon Brown's flagship scheme.
If it were successfully blocked in Scotland, then its integrity would be seriously undermined for the rest of the UK, given that the Prime Minister believes nationwide ID cards will be effective in combating terrorism, organised crime, identity fraud and illegal immigration.
The Liberal Democrats aired their strong opposition to the ID cards scheme yesterday while civil liberties groups said it would be disastrous for people's privacy and race relations. The Conservatives pledged that if they came to power, they would scrap the "utterly
discredited" project.
Yesterday, Ms Smith, in announcing revised plans, boasted how most Britons would have a biometric identity card by 2017. She stressed she wanted as many people as possible to "enjoy the two key benefits of the National Identity Scheme - improved protection and greater convenience".
The Secretary of State added: "We will be able to better protect ourselves against identity fraud as well as protecting our communities against crime, illegal immigration and terrorism. It will help us to prove our identity in the course of our daily lives when travelling, opening a bank account, applying for a new job or accessing government services."
The first people to be compelled to get ID cards in the UK will be non-EU nationals. Next year, they will be issued to some people with "sensitive jobs" such as staff at airports and power stations. From 2010, young people will be able to volunteer for the cards and the following year all passport applicants will be automatically registered, having the option of choosing to have a passport, ID card or both.
However, critics believe the UK Government's programme is compulsion "by stealth". They fear millions of Britons could be forced to apply for an ID card because of their jobs while another concern is that students will have to have an ID card to open bank accounts and obtain loans.
Last night, a Scottish Government spokesman claimed the supposed voluntary scheme for most Britons was "a compulsory one in all but name". He told The Herald: "We are opposed to the concept of compulsory ID cards. We feel the UK Government is attempting to introduce this measure by stealth. We will be making representations to them to make clear our vehement opposition to it."
Under the previous and present Edinburgh administrations, it has been made clear ID cards will not be needed to access public services.
The spokesman stressed how it was not just the Scottish Government but also the Scottish Parliament which had "no desire" to see an ID card scheme.
Earlier, when the Prime Minister's spokesman was asked if he thought the UK Government would encounter difficulties with the Scottish Government over the proposed ID card scheme, he replied he had "no reason to believe" this would be the case and that there were "well-established mechanisms" for discussing the issue with Edinburgh.
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Posted by: Jimmy the Pie on 11:48pm Thu 6 Mar 08
Good on you Alex - tell Broon to poke it.
Good on you Alex - tell Broon to poke it.
Posted by: Brian D Finch, Brigadoon on 11:52pm Thu 6 Mar 08
Two years ago, the Gordon Brown-led Treasury commissioned an independent report into ID Cards. Sir James Crosby, who headed the team, has just issued the report (published by HMG). In the report, Sir James details "10 broad principles for the design of any ID card scheme". While I have not yet studied the report in detail (having only had a quick shufti at it), according to Guy Herbert in the Grauniad the governments plans break all ten principles.
See for yourself at: http://www.hm-trea
sury.gov.uk/media/6/
7/id
entity_assurance0603
08.pdf
Two years ago, the Gordon Brown-led Treasury commissioned an independent report into ID Cards. Sir James Crosby, who headed the team, has just issued the report (published by HMG). In the report, Sir James details "10 broad principles for the design of any ID card scheme". While I have not yet studied the report in detail (having only had a quick shufti at it), according to Guy Herbert in the Grauniad the governments plans break all ten principles.
See for yourself at: http://www.hm-trea
sury.gov.uk/media/6/
7/id
entity_assurance0603
08.pdf
Posted by: JC on 11:59pm Thu 6 Mar 08
So, Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists.
salmond needs to grow up. lots of countries have ID cards
So, Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists.
salmond needs to grow up. lots of countries have ID cards
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 11:59pm Thu 6 Mar 08
The Scottish government makes decisions on behalf of the people of Scotland according to the will of the people of Scotland. Full stop.
The Scottish government makes decisions on behalf of the people of Scotland according to the will of the people of Scotland. Full stop.
Posted by: megz, glasgow on 12:01am Fri 7 Mar 08
I'm sorry but if they can't handle the information they already have they aren't getting any more of mine.
I'm sorry but if they can't handle the information they already have they aren't getting any more of mine.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:03am Fri 7 Mar 08
JC: I See Alien People[quote]Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists[/quote] Only an utter balloon makes a statement like that.
JC: I See Alien People
Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists
Only an utter balloon makes a statement like that.
Posted by: Jwil, Lanarkshire on 12:05am Fri 7 Mar 08
There is a solution to the difficulties Brown faces in Scotland. Give us a referendum for a vote on independence.
There is a solution to the difficulties Brown faces in Scotland. Give us a referendum for a vote on independence.
Posted by: scotland only 8% of UK, consumes 11% of social security on 12:06am Fri 7 Mar 08
No ID Card, No Barnett!
Posted by: Jimmy the Pie, Orkney on 12:09am Fri 7 Mar 08
No ID Card No Barnet- Independence
No ID Card No Barnet- Independence
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:09am Fri 7 Mar 08
8% Idiot 92% Moron[quote]No ID Card, No Barnett![/quote] No hair? Whatever do you mean?
8% Idiot 92% Moron
No ID Card, No Barnett!
No hair? Whatever do you mean?
Posted by: daydreamer, Edinburgh on 12:11am Fri 7 Mar 08
"the Prime Minister believes nationwide ID cards will be effective in combating terrorism, organised crime, identity fraud and illegal immigration" - can Michael Settle read Gordon Brown's mind, or has he fallen for at least part of the Westminster Labour propaganda and passed it on as the truth to us via the Herald?
Everything that can be done to stop these dreadful cards must be done.
"the Prime Minister believes nationwide ID cards will be effective in combating terrorism, organised crime, identity fraud and illegal immigration" - can Michael Settle read Gordon Brown's mind, or has he fallen for at least part of the Westminster Labour propaganda and passed it on as the truth to us via the Herald?
Everything that can be done to stop these dreadful cards must be done.
Posted by: tris, scotland on 12:14am Fri 7 Mar 08
A few years ago I thought that Identity Cards were ok. They have them in France. A litle card with your photogrpah and name... kinda proving who you are.
But from what I can gather.....
This set of pratts wants to have biometric cards, with untested science, and all sorts of information from your banking details to your health records. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Who can be trusted with all this information? What happens if you lose it? Don't tell me that clever people wont be able to come up with readers.
I'm with you 100% First Minister. I will not have one of these cards.
It's a bit of a dead dog though. It's only the loony Labour party that wants them, so I guessafter the next election they will bite the dust with the current Westminster government, and all the money that this fool Smith has spent on them will be wasted. Hope Scotland isn't paying anything towards it.
A few years ago I thought that Identity Cards were ok. They have them in France. A litle card with your photogrpah and name... kinda proving who you are.
But from what I can gather.....
This set of pratts wants to have biometric cards, with untested science, and all sorts of information from your banking details to your health records. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Who can be trusted with all this information? What happens if you lose it? Don't tell me that clever people wont be able to come up with readers.
I'm with you 100% First Minister. I will not have one of these cards.
It's a bit of a dead dog though. It's only the loony Labour party that wants them, so I guessafter the next election they will bite the dust with the current Westminster government, and all the money that this fool Smith has spent on them will be wasted. Hope Scotland isn't paying anything towards it.
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 12:15am Fri 7 Mar 08
from the article ;-
Earlier, when the Prime Minister's spokesman was asked if he thought the UK Government would encounter difficulties with the Scottish Government over the proposed ID card scheme, he replied he had "no reason to believe" this would be the case and that there were "well-established mechanisms" for discussing the issue with Edinburgh.
Oh yeah, like the famous - we phoned and nobody was there.
Or perhaps your thinking of screaming at wendy like you did wee joke, or maybe you can just hae a wurd wi ming
from the article ;-
Earlier, when the Prime Minister's spokesman was asked if he thought the UK Government would encounter difficulties with the Scottish Government over the proposed ID card scheme, he replied he had "no reason to believe" this would be the case and that there were "well-established mechanisms" for discussing the issue with Edinburgh.
Oh yeah, like the famous - we phoned and nobody was there.
Or perhaps your thinking of screaming at wendy like you did wee joke, or maybe you can just hae a wurd wi ming
Posted by: Brian D Finch, Brigadoon on 12:20am Fri 7 Mar 08
tris: [quote]Hope Scotland isn't paying anything towards it.[/quote] Scotland pays more to the Treasury than it gets back. Therefore, Scotland is paying towards it.
tris:
Hope Scotland isn't paying anything towards it.
Scotland pays more to the Treasury than it gets back. Therefore, Scotland is paying towards it.
Posted by: scotland only 8% of UK, consumes 11% of social security on 12:20am Fri 7 Mar 08
I note these trade stats show scotland in a bad light once more!
http://tinyurl.com/3
x6d6r
I note these trade stats show scotland in a bad light once more!
http://tinyurl.com/3
x6d6r
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:21am Fri 7 Mar 08
Tris[quote]A litle card with your photogrpah and name...[/quote] If you drive a car in the UK that what you get, a wee plastic card with your mug shot on it.
But they want elves, leprechauns, zombies, and Father Christmas to have one too so they can be identified easily.
Tris
A litle card with your photogrpah and name...
If you drive a car in the UK that what you get, a wee plastic card with your mug shot on it.
But they want elves, leprechauns, zombies, and Father Christmas to have one too so they can be identified easily.
Posted by: Joe Shmo, Glasgow on 12:26am Fri 7 Mar 08
I.D. cards stop terrorism. You gotta be yanking ma chain. Lets start with not invading coutries first and take it from there...
I.D. cards stop terrorism. You gotta be yanking ma chain. Lets start with not invading coutries first and take it from there...
Posted by: DouglasT, kirkintilloch on 12:31am Fri 7 Mar 08
Speed cameras were introduced to cover black spots and reduce accidents. Great idea. A few years later, speed cameras have been introduced nationwide as revenue-producers. So it is with id cards. Orwell's 1984 is already here.
Speed cameras were introduced to cover black spots and reduce accidents. Great idea. A few years later, speed cameras have been introduced nationwide as revenue-producers. So it is with id cards. Orwell's 1984 is already here.
Posted by: Archie, No more Scottish funding of London on 12:34am Fri 7 Mar 08
Good on you Alex,
Tell them to shove their ID cards up their bahookey.
Good on you Alex,
Tell them to shove their ID cards up their bahookey.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:37am Fri 7 Mar 08
"Oh, Gawd, Mohammed. Those Scotty people are thinking of having the plastic card with face on. Now they will know we are not Scottish when they ask to see [italic]our[/italic] card. This is the end of our master plan to take over the land of the big muckle horse with antlers Up Their Kilts With A Paint Brush is doomed, I tell you."
"Shall I destroy all the "Me Am Tartan Tory" badges, Jamal?"
"Yes. What a terrible waste. I was so hoping to do a liitle golf on the Royal and Ancient."
"On the Royal and Ancient, what, Jamal?"
"No, you misunderstand. That is the how the Scotties refer to the seat of their sovereignty - the Royal and Very Ancient."
"May Allah bless her, Jamal, fine lady that she is."
"Oh, Gawd, Mohammed. Those Scotty people are thinking of having the plastic card with face on. Now they will know we are not Scottish when they ask to see
our card. This is the end of our master plan to take over the land of the big muckle horse with antlers Up Their Kilts With A Paint Brush is doomed, I tell you."
"Shall I destroy all the "Me Am Tartan Tory" badges, Jamal?"
"Yes. What a terrible waste. I was so hoping to do a liitle golf on the Royal and Ancient."
"On the Royal and Ancient, what, Jamal?"
"No, you misunderstand. That is the how the Scotties refer to the seat of their sovereignty - the Royal and Very Ancient."
"May Allah bless her, Jamal, fine lady that she is."
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:40am Fri 7 Mar 08
8% Idiot 92 Moron[quote]la , seems like your [/quote] Got you, you little tosspot!
A good old English term hooked you. Are you logging in from East Finchley?
8% Idiot 92 Moron
la , seems like your
Got you, you little tosspot!
A good old English term hooked you. Are you logging in from East Finchley?
Posted by: Kent, Edinburgh on 12:44am Fri 7 Mar 08
If Gordon Brown believes that ID cards will be effective against organised crime, does this mean he is trying to tackle the problems in the Labour party?
I think we should be told!
If Gordon Brown believes that ID cards will be effective against organised crime, does this mean he is trying to tackle the problems in the Labour party?
I think we should be told!
Posted by: duncan on 12:48am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]JC[/bold] wrote:
So, Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists.
salmond needs to grow up. lots of countries have ID cards[/quote] lots of countries don't have ID cards. are they all havens for illegal immigrants and terrorists?
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Id_cards#Na
tions_without
JC wrote:
So, Scotland would be a haven for illegal immigrants and terrorists.
salmond needs to grow up. lots of countries have ID cards
lots of countries don't have ID cards. are they all havens for illegal immigrants and terrorists?
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Id_cards#Na
tions_without
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 12:50am Fri 7 Mar 08
Get your "[bold]Tartan Toureg[/bold] " badges here!
Get your "
Tartan Toureg " badges here!
Posted by: scotland only 8% of UK, consumes 11% of social security on 12:58am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
8% Idiot 92 Moron[quote]la , seems like your [/quote] Got you, you little tosspot! A good old English term hooked you. Are you logging in from East Finchley? [/quote] Yes, dont you remember me from the gay bar last sunday night?
Los Angeles wrote:
8% Idiot 92 Moronla , seems like your
Got you, you little tosspot! A good old English term hooked you. Are you logging in from East Finchley?
Yes, dont you remember me from the gay bar last sunday night?
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 1:05am Fri 7 Mar 08
Got a big tattoo of an eagle on your forehead, 8% Idiot? With that you won't need an ID card. LoL
Got a big tattoo of an eagle on your forehead, 8% Idiot? With that you won't need an ID card. LoL
Posted by: Stardog, Edinburgh on 1:10am Fri 7 Mar 08
"the Prime Minister believes nationwide ID cards will be effective in combating terrorism, organised crime, identity fraud and illegal immigration"
-----------------
Who cares about terrorism? More people die of stabbings/murders than are killed by terrorists. And it our country wasn't being such an **** to other countries, maybe they wouldn't hate us so much.
Who cares about ID theft? Stop throwing important documents out in the trash.
Who cares about illegal immigration? It doesn't affect me in the slightest. They probably run half of our services and do a better job than most Scottish chavs would.
"the Prime Minister believes nationwide ID cards will be effective in combating terrorism, organised crime, identity fraud and illegal immigration"
-----------------
Who cares about terrorism? More people die of stabbings/murders than are killed by terrorists. And it our country wasn't being such an **** to other countries, maybe they wouldn't hate us so much.
Who cares about ID theft? Stop throwing important documents out in the trash.
Who cares about illegal immigration? It doesn't affect me in the slightest. They probably run half of our services and do a better job than most Scottish chavs would.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 1:13am Fri 7 Mar 08
Stardog[quote]More people die of stabbings/murders than are killed by terrorists.[/quote] Yesterday it was "300 gangs in Glasgow" The idea that they would even trouble to carry ID cards is laughable.
Stardog
More people die of stabbings/murders than are killed by terrorists.
Yesterday it was "300 gangs in Glasgow" The idea that they would even trouble to carry ID cards is laughable.
Posted by: Dave, Away on 1:23am Fri 7 Mar 08
Ask the US how ID cards work, chuckle. Enterprising border types whip up new ones, sell them to newly arrived across-the-Rio-Grand
e types who then use them to apply for Social Services :-)
What amazes me it the Unity at Holyrood! Conservatives, SNP and LibDems together as one!
I'd be more inclined to believe Mr. B if he wasn't busy losing all the information he *does* have in the Post, the Wastebasket and having Westminister employing a slew of illegals in highly sensitive positions for starters....
Maybe he'll compromise and agree to a number on the forehead and an oath of allegiance to the Emperor....
Ask the US how ID cards work, chuckle. Enterprising border types whip up new ones, sell them to newly arrived across-the-Rio-Grand
e types who then use them to apply for Social Services :-)
What amazes me it the Unity at Holyrood! Conservatives, SNP and LibDems together as one!
I'd be more inclined to believe Mr. B if he wasn't busy losing all the information he *does* have in the Post, the Wastebasket and having Westminister employing a slew of illegals in highly sensitive positions for starters....
Maybe he'll compromise and agree to a number on the forehead and an oath of allegiance to the Emperor....
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 1:34am Fri 7 Mar 08
DA ON ID[quote]Ask the US how ID cards work,[/quote] ID here, Dave Away, is normally by driver licence, and if that's not available, a banker's card. There are no "ID" cards as such.
Incidentally, no store or shop ever asks for ID if you pay by banker's card. If it swipes and goes through you've got the goods. Back in old Blighty they not only ask to see ID, but scrutize your signature on the bloody bank card, even if the purchase is ten pounds or less.
"This signature doesn't match the one on your card." says the spotty wee Herbert behind the cash desk
DA ON ID
Ask the US how ID cards work,
ID here, Dave Away, is normally by driver licence, and if that's not available, a banker's card. There are no "ID" cards as such.
Incidentally, no store or shop ever asks for ID if you pay by banker's card. If it swipes and goes through you've got the goods. Back in old Blighty they not only ask to see ID, but scrutize your signature on the bloody bank card, even if the purchase is ten pounds or less.
"This signature doesn't match the one on your card." says the spotty wee Herbert behind the cash desk
Posted by: Archie, Argyll on 1:39am Fri 7 Mar 08
It's obviously just another big money scam for the chosen big money scamsters.
We already have an ID in the form of a NI number.
Ye canny con us Broon.
Yer a right card yersel so ye ur,
An a bit ai a ticket as well.
It's obviously just another big money scam for the chosen big money scamsters.
We already have an ID in the form of a NI number.
Ye canny con us Broon.
Yer a right card yersel so ye ur,
An a bit ai a ticket as well.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 1:41am Fri 7 Mar 08
You're right, Archie. It's the global security industry, hand-in-glove with governments. And when your government deals with them they have lost sight of the people. Time to drop them in the Wash.
You're right, Archie. It's the global security industry, hand-in-glove with governments. And when your government deals with them they have lost sight of the people. Time to drop them in the Wash.
Posted by: Graham, Glasgow on 1:47am Fri 7 Mar 08
The ID THING IS not going to happen. Wee Alec is on the Bandwagon. MI5 HAS EVERYONE ON RECORD including Wee Alec. You can get all the info on a Tesco,Sainsbury, Asda, Marks and Sparks Kerd. LA is just bored! Make a phonecall to purchase anything, give your postcode, up pops your name. BUSINESS HAS TAKEN OVER. NO WHERE TO HIDE. [bold]bold[/bold]
The ID THING IS not going to happen. Wee Alec is on the Bandwagon. MI5 HAS EVERYONE ON RECORD including Wee Alec. You can get all the info on a Tesco,Sainsbury, Asda, Marks and Sparks Kerd. LA is just bored! Make a phonecall to purchase anything, give your postcode, up pops your name. BUSINESS HAS TAKEN OVER. NO WHERE TO HIDE.
Posted by: Archie, Argyll on 1:48am Fri 7 Mar 08
Aye LA,
An efter they punt us a wi a cerd, some scientific so an so will decide we would a be better aff wi a digital chip welded oantae wur arses.
Then we'll no need any o them cos DNA registration will be compulsory,
Then they'll change the government who will repeal the DNA registration in favour of a new super card that is allegedly infallable.
Then they'll blow up the planet wi their nuclear crap and we'll no need any of them efter a.
Aye LA,
An efter they punt us a wi a cerd, some scientific so an so will decide we would a be better aff wi a digital chip welded oantae wur arses.
Then we'll no need any o them cos DNA registration will be compulsory,
Then they'll change the government who will repeal the DNA registration in favour of a new super card that is allegedly infallable.
Then they'll blow up the planet wi their nuclear crap and we'll no need any of them efter a.
Posted by: marzipan_mad, Edinburgh on 1:52am Fri 7 Mar 08
I am so glad Salmond is standing against this ridiculous policy. Once you sign away your blood and other details of your identity anyone can steal it and stitch you up. Even if we pretend for just one moment that the government made the information safe, do you actually trust the government's access to it? It gives them too much power and knowledge about you.
I'm not against ID cards in principal, but am against biometric ones. And by the way... the comments by "scotland only 8% of UK, consumes 11% of social security " reflect the influence of the anti-Scottish xenophobic "British" newspapers down south... check out the abuse on The Telegraph... http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/news/main.jht
ml?xml=/news/2008/03
/05/nscots105.xml
Apparently Scotland is entirely funded by a "subsidy" from "English taxes" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Utter bile...
I am so glad Salmond is standing against this ridiculous policy. Once you sign away your blood and other details of your identity anyone can steal it and stitch you up. Even if we pretend for just one moment that the government made the information safe, do you actually trust the government's access to it? It gives them too much power and knowledge about you.
I'm not against ID cards in principal, but am against biometric ones. And by the way... the comments by "scotland only 8% of UK, consumes 11% of social security " reflect the influence of the anti-Scottish xenophobic "British" newspapers down south... check out the abuse on The Telegraph... http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/news/main.jht
ml?xml=/news/2008/03
/05/nscots105.xml
Apparently Scotland is entirely funded by a "subsidy" from "English taxes" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Utter bile...
Posted by: Steve A, Glasgow on 1:58am Fri 7 Mar 08
We don't have a terrorist problem in Scotland and the labour spooks know it??By their policies shall we know them who really benefited from that burning jeep at the airport?Good to remind us Scots that we are not immune wasn't it!And the clincher is what they are doing to that poor guy smeaton using him as a political pawn anybody remember Hitler burned down the reichstag and blamed it on terrorists?
We don't have a terrorist problem in Scotland and the labour spooks know it??By their policies shall we know them who really benefited from that burning jeep at the airport?Good to remind us Scots that we are not immune wasn't it!And the clincher is what they are doing to that poor guy smeaton using him as a political pawn anybody remember Hitler burned down the reichstag and blamed it on terrorists?
Posted by: Dave, Away on 2:05am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
DA ON ID[quote]Ask the US how ID cards work,[/quote] ID here, Dave Away, is normally by driver licence, and if that's not available, a banker's card. There are no "ID" cards as such. Incidentally, no store or shop ever asks for ID if you pay by banker's card. If it swipes and goes through you've got the goods. Back in old Blighty they not only ask to see ID, but scrutize your signature on the bloody bank card, even if the purchase is ten pounds or less. "This signature doesn't match the one on your card." says the spotty wee Herbert behind the cash desk [/quote] Don't you require "green" cards or some proof of citizenship (number or some such) to get work or access to government programs though?
(I agree with the gang part - I think my dear departed great granny had 5 aliases....we knew here as Grandma Mitchell but Dad said they were never actually sure which of them was her real name....the wee gang members would probably soon have a dozen wee cards....for sale to foreign blokes with some dough....)
Los Angeles wrote:
DA ON IDAsk the US how ID cards work,
ID here, Dave Away, is normally by driver licence, and if that's not available, a banker's card. There are no "ID" cards as such. Incidentally, no store or shop ever asks for ID if you pay by banker's card. If it swipes and goes through you've got the goods. Back in old Blighty they not only ask to see ID, but scrutize your signature on the bloody bank card, even if the purchase is ten pounds or less. "This signature doesn't match the one on your card." says the spotty wee Herbert behind the cash desk
Don't you require "green" cards or some proof of citizenship (number or some such) to get work or access to government programs though?
(I agree with the gang part - I think my dear departed great granny had 5 aliases....we knew here as Grandma Mitchell but Dad said they were never actually sure which of them was her real name....the wee gang members would probably soon have a dozen wee cards....for sale to foreign blokes with some dough....)
Posted by: Graham, Glasgow on 2:06am Fri 7 Mar 08
Marzipan,1:52am. You are melting, get oot the hoose noo. Before its to late.[bold]bold[/bold]
Marzipan,1:52am. You are melting, get oot the hoose noo. Before its to late.
Posted by: Dave, Away on 2:08am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Graham[/bold] wrote:
The ID THING IS not going to happen. Wee Alec is on the Bandwagon. MI5 HAS EVERYONE ON RECORD including Wee Alec. You can get all the info on a Tesco,Sainsbury, Asda, Marks and Sparks Kerd. LA is just bored! Make a phonecall to purchase anything, give your postcode, up pops your name. BUSINESS HAS TAKEN OVER. NO WHERE TO HIDE. [bold]bold[/bold] [/quote] Ah, but Graham how then will Mr. Brown be able to hire the bureaucracy to manage it?!
It would take at least 10,000 clerks, and another 20,000 managers :-)
I think I'm being too cynical...time to go for a break :-)
Graham wrote:
The ID THING IS not going to happen. Wee Alec is on the Bandwagon. MI5 HAS EVERYONE ON RECORD including Wee Alec. You can get all the info on a Tesco,Sainsbury, Asda, Marks and Sparks Kerd. LA is just bored! Make a phonecall to purchase anything, give your postcode, up pops your name. BUSINESS HAS TAKEN OVER. NO WHERE TO HIDE.
Ah, but Graham how then will Mr. Brown be able to hire the bureaucracy to manage it?!
It would take at least 10,000 clerks, and another 20,000 managers :-)
I think I'm being too cynical...time to go for a break :-)
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 2:09am Fri 7 Mar 08
Marzipan Is Yer Man[quote]Apparently Scotland is entirely funded by a "subsidy" from "English taxes[/quote] And you just know those comments come from serial tax dodgers and social security fraudsters!
"A bi' ov insurance scam 'ere, a bi' ov dubowel identity scam there, an' Bob's yer uncle, Fanny's yer aunt - in the back pocket, docket, down the old Bull 'n Bush, two pints ov yer best bi''er, barman, on that' table, an' a packet ov crispy cracknel. Loverly."
.
Marzipan Is Yer Man
Apparently Scotland is entirely funded by a "subsidy" from "English taxes
And you just know those comments come from serial tax dodgers and social security fraudsters!
"A bi' ov insurance scam 'ere, a bi' ov dubowel identity scam there, an' Bob's yer uncle, Fanny's yer aunt - in the back pocket, docket, down the old Bull 'n Bush, two pints ov yer best bi''er, barman, on that' table, an' a packet ov crispy cracknel. Loverly."
.
Posted by: Jock Politicaljunkie, Glasgow on 2:10am Fri 7 Mar 08
Quote: "Yesterday, Ms Smith, in announcing revised plans, boasted how most Britons would have a biometric identity card by 2017."
Is predicting the future also one of her talents? - that NuLabour will still be in power in 2017 and Scotland will still be in the union?!?
No, she can't!! The Red Tories are so out of touch they just can't get how unpopular ID Cards are and how NO ONE TRUSTS THEM with our information.
Quote: "Yesterday, Ms Smith, in announcing revised plans, boasted how most Britons would have a biometric identity card by 2017."
Is predicting the future also one of her talents? - that NuLabour will still be in power in 2017 and Scotland will still be in the union?!?
No, she can't!! The Red Tories are so out of touch they just can't get how unpopular ID Cards are and how NO ONE TRUSTS THEM with our information.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 2:15am Fri 7 Mar 08
DA ON ID[quote]Don't you require "green" cards or some proof of citizenship to get work or access to government programs though?[/quote] No policeman or clerk asks to see a Green Card - full citizenship for non-Americans. There are intermediary visas that allow you to work in various jobs and professions. The Green Card is comprehensive permission and tax paid in the USA. But even with the other types of visa fees and wages are invariably taxed at source.
The entire debate about illegal Mexicans and Latinos is because all they need is a driver's licence to pass as a full citizens for as long as they remain undiscovered. Getting a driver's licence is a doddle.
.
DA ON ID
Don't you require "green" cards or some proof of citizenship to get work or access to government programs though?
No policeman or clerk asks to see a Green Card - full citizenship for non-Americans. There are intermediary visas that allow you to work in various jobs and professions. The Green Card is comprehensive permission and tax paid in the USA. But even with the other types of visa fees and wages are invariably taxed at source.
The entire debate about illegal Mexicans and Latinos is because all they need is a driver's licence to pass as a full citizens for as long as they remain undiscovered. Getting a driver's licence is a doddle.
.
Posted by: Graham, Glasgow on 2:15am Fri 7 Mar 08
Dave, 2:08am. No worry Tesco will manage it![bold]bold[/bold]
Dave, 2:08am. No worry Tesco will manage it!
Posted by: mike, London on 2:30am Fri 7 Mar 08
They are having a laugh,ID cards to combat terrorism?,they have given out NI numbers like confetti.I would'nt have one if they paid me.
They are having a laugh,ID cards to combat terrorism?,they have given out NI numbers like confetti.I would'nt have one if they paid me.
Posted by: Edward, Edinburgh on 2:34am Fri 7 Mar 08
Intersting points to ponder
1. Jacqui Smith couldnt give a flying fig and will ignore Kenny
MacAskill, she always does!
2. The ID cards will be funded proportialy by Scotland, like with all
cross border arrangements, wether we lik it or not
3. Expect the people that will produce and manage the ID system to
be linked in some way to Labour (example Scottish voting
machines and management by a company with Neil Kinnock on
the board)
4. ID Cards on the contintnet are most definately not the same , the
are mainly versions of a mini birth cert with where and wne born,
thumb print and mug shot, very very low tech
I hope that Labour not only loose at the next election, but are wiped of the face of the earth! and Im speaking as a long term labour supporter! All this new labour crap does my head in. Blair and Brown have turned the party into a bunch of back stabbing spivs
The english have their local elections in May, hope the screw them well an truelly into the ground!
Intersting points to ponder
1. Jacqui Smith couldnt give a flying fig and will ignore Kenny
MacAskill, she always does!
2. The ID cards will be funded proportialy by Scotland, like with all
cross border arrangements, wether we lik it or not
3. Expect the people that will produce and manage the ID system to
be linked in some way to Labour (example Scottish voting
machines and management by a company with Neil Kinnock on
the board)
4. ID Cards on the contintnet are most definately not the same , the
are mainly versions of a mini birth cert with where and wne born,
thumb print and mug shot, very very low tech
I hope that Labour not only loose at the next election, but are wiped of the face of the earth! and Im speaking as a long term labour supporter! All this new labour crap does my head in. Blair and Brown have turned the party into a bunch of back stabbing spivs
The english have their local elections in May, hope the screw them well an truelly into the ground!
Posted by: Graham, Glasgow on 2:47am Fri 7 Mar 08
Edward, 2:34am. Are you the Confessor! The long term one! No one has to do your heid in. Think for yourself Eddie and do your ain heid in. Nae excuse then.[bold]bold[/bold]
Edward, 2:34am. Are you the Confessor! The long term one! No one has to do your heid in. Think for yourself Eddie and do your ain heid in. Nae excuse then.
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 3:21am Fri 7 Mar 08
Edward Forward[quote]3. Expect the people that will produce and manage the ID system to be linked in some way to Labour -Scottish voting machines and management by a company with Neil Kinnock on the board)[/quote] I would think it a certainty.
What is so depressing is the monolithicpower behind momentum with which Labour pursue a discredited and disliked proposal. It's their version of poll tax.
Edward Forward
3. Expect the people that will produce and manage the ID system to be linked in some way to Labour -Scottish voting machines and management by a company with Neil Kinnock on the board)
I would think it a certainty.
What is so depressing is the monolithicpower behind momentum with which Labour pursue a discredited and disliked proposal. It's their version of poll tax.
Posted by: Scunnert, Travelling in Nihlon on 4:25am Fri 7 Mar 08
I am glad to see the government opposing ID Cards. I'd be ecsatic to see them opposing the last labour administrations plans to privatise Scottish water by stealth. Instead the have chosen to stay quiet on the issue. Well I did realise that Alex was a neo-con economist but thought that he'd be held in check by the rank and file. Apparently not. Alex trotted out Tam Nairn to encourage us to embrace the global economy and become dwarves.
Tell you what Alex give us independence and make it quick. I don't think there'll be much left otherwise. You'll have given it all away to your corporate buddies. Globalscots - ach!
I am glad to see the government opposing ID Cards. I'd be ecsatic to see them opposing the last labour administrations plans to privatise Scottish water by stealth. Instead the have chosen to stay quiet on the issue. Well I did realise that Alex was a neo-con economist but thought that he'd be held in check by the rank and file. Apparently not. Alex trotted out Tam Nairn to encourage us to embrace the global economy and become dwarves.
Tell you what Alex give us independence and make it quick. I don't think there'll be much left otherwise. You'll have given it all away to your corporate buddies. Globalscots - ach!
Posted by: gordon Brown ate my hamster, Australia on 4:42am Fri 7 Mar 08
Two of the biggest fans of ID cards is david blunkett and his dug, who sits on the board of a company who er... implement id card schemes.
Two of the biggest fans of ID cards is david blunkett and his dug, who sits on the board of a company who er... implement id card schemes.
Posted by: Donald Anderson, glasgow on 4:52am Fri 7 Mar 08
An Independent Scotland would not be a nuclear target, nor would she be terrorising anyone. She would have Imperialist aspirations, nor be drawn into any more Imperialist wars. Perhaps without Scottish cannon fodder and resources England might wake up to its terrorist past.
An Independent Scotland would not be a nuclear target, nor would she be terrorising anyone. She would have Imperialist aspirations, nor be drawn into any more Imperialist wars. Perhaps without Scottish cannon fodder and resources England might wake up to its terrorist past.
Posted by: Donald Anderson, glasgow on 4:52am Fri 7 Mar 08
An Independent Scotland would not be a nuclear target, nor would she be terrorising anyone. She would have Imperialist aspirations, nor be drawn into any more Imperialist wars. Perhaps without Scottish cannon fodder and resources England might wake up to its terrorist past.
An Independent Scotland would not be a nuclear target, nor would she be terrorising anyone. She would have Imperialist aspirations, nor be drawn into any more Imperialist wars. Perhaps without Scottish cannon fodder and resources England might wake up to its terrorist past.
Posted by: Paul, Paisley on 5:20am Fri 7 Mar 08
'We need to expand the economy Gordon.'
'OK - let's introduce ID cards, that should make EDS and any other company I'll get a directorship with billions!'
'And we'll make a donation!'
'Winners all round!'
'We need to expand the economy Gordon.'
'OK - let's introduce ID cards, that should make EDS and any other company I'll get a directorship with billions!'
'And we'll make a donation!'
'Winners all round!'
Posted by: Yok Finney, Ross-shire on 5:42am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote]Who can be trusted with all this information? What happens if you lose it?[/quote]
What would happen when [bold]they[/bold] lose it? Which seems quite likely when it is outsourced to a foreign-based operator?
Who can be trusted with all this information? What happens if you lose it?
What would happen when
they lose it? Which seems quite likely when it is outsourced to a foreign-based operator?
Posted by: Catharine, Winnipeg Canada on 6:16am Fri 7 Mar 08
I've never understood how holding an identity card would have prevented the atrocities in London on July 7 - or the Glasgow airport attempt. Are they going to be like the magic explosive-proof Ziplock baggy we North Americans are still being forced to carry our liquids in whilst flying? Perhaps some moron in Westminster actually believes that the (apparently) thousands of terrorists running rampant in the UK want to be anonymous when they blow themselves up in the name of some twisted religion, but I've seen too many jhihad videos played on television news to believe that. This is just one more step down the slippery slope that our governments, almost certainly at the behest of the paranoid and thankfully soon to be gone Bushco, are dragging us in an imaginary "war on terror" (read "keep the oil flowing") and more fools us for allowing them to do so.
I've never understood how holding an identity card would have prevented the atrocities in London on July 7 - or the Glasgow airport attempt. Are they going to be like the magic explosive-proof Ziplock baggy we North Americans are still being forced to carry our liquids in whilst flying? Perhaps some moron in Westminster actually believes that the (apparently) thousands of terrorists running rampant in the UK want to be anonymous when they blow themselves up in the name of some twisted religion, but I've seen too many jhihad videos played on television news to believe that. This is just one more step down the slippery slope that our governments, almost certainly at the behest of the paranoid and thankfully soon to be gone Bushco, are dragging us in an imaginary "war on terror" (read "keep the oil flowing") and more fools us for allowing them to do so.
Posted by: wisnaeme, wisnae there on 6:21am Fri 7 Mar 08
.
The liars are at it again, this time on the subject of ID cards.
Was it only yesterday that they announced that ID cards would be put on hold?
...and now today we have a representative of the liars party, squirming on the Politics Today programme. Can I reassure everyone she says.. and I switched over. Students? Airport workers? Just like their stealth taxes, it will be introduced a bit at a time by stealth.
I posted that yesterday on a comment section in the herald, by the way. it was Milburn's turn last night on the BeeB but he was merely evasive.
So the Tory government in waiting are against that sort of thing. My, we can take great comfort from that. it's bu11 $hite of course.
One of the largest area of growth in the UK is the service sector. In particularly commercial security firms, commercial data collection ,storage and processing for clients. There's mega gravitas to be made, palms to be greased, lobbyists to perform, consultants to consult and promises to be made of employment to politicians who have been useful while in the public employ.
... and so the Tories promise that they will kill ID cards stone dead when they return to power. Aye right.
...and as for the Fib Dems, they wouldn't have the capacity to distinguish their @rses from their elbows as has been shown frequently and all too recently.
ID cards are coming, for there is money to made and the movers and shakers, Mr beezness associates are determined to make it from a captive market. That's us, by the way. Just another stealth tax imposed on us in the name of whatever to please the new best pals and supporters of so called joint ventures. of private enterprise works. Well for some people anyways.
Funny how situations can be reversed with the passage of time. Once apon a time it was the river Thames that was a stinking sewer and cess pit, full of putrefaction and dicease. Foul, nauseous and bad for your health. So full of corruption as it honked beside the Houses of Parliament.
Now the reverse is true . Father Thames is sweet smelling, with otters , fish and fowl and beside it the Houses of Parliament are now .......
There is only one way left for unwilling Scots and the Scottish government to avoid the fate of having ID control freakery imposed on the nation. A nation that is already resentful of unwanted Westminster impositions, ID cards being but the latest outrage amongst the many preceeding , I might add.
.
.
The liars are at it again, this time on the subject of ID cards.
Was it only yesterday that they announced that ID cards would be put on hold?
...and now today we have a representative of the liars party, squirming on the Politics Today programme. Can I reassure everyone she says.. and I switched over. Students? Airport workers? Just like their stealth taxes, it will be introduced a bit at a time by stealth.
I posted that yesterday on a comment section in the herald, by the way. it was Milburn's turn last night on the BeeB but he was merely evasive.
So the Tory government in waiting are against that sort of thing. My, we can take great comfort from that. it's bu11 $hite of course.
One of the largest area of growth in the UK is the service sector. In particularly commercial security firms, commercial data collection ,storage and processing for clients. There's mega gravitas to be made, palms to be greased, lobbyists to perform, consultants to consult and promises to be made of employment to politicians who have been useful while in the public employ.
... and so the Tories promise that they will kill ID cards stone dead when they return to power. Aye right.
...and as for the Fib Dems, they wouldn't have the capacity to distinguish their @rses from their elbows as has been shown frequently and all too recently.
ID cards are coming, for there is money to made and the movers and shakers, Mr beezness associates are determined to make it from a captive market. That's us, by the way. Just another stealth tax imposed on us in the name of whatever to please the new best pals and supporters of so called joint ventures. of private enterprise works. Well for some people anyways.
Funny how situations can be reversed with the passage of time. Once apon a time it was the river Thames that was a stinking sewer and cess pit, full of putrefaction and dicease. Foul, nauseous and bad for your health. So full of corruption as it honked beside the Houses of Parliament.
Now the reverse is true . Father Thames is sweet smelling, with otters , fish and fowl and beside it the Houses of Parliament are now .......
There is only one way left for unwilling Scots and the Scottish government to avoid the fate of having ID control freakery imposed on the nation. A nation that is already resentful of unwanted Westminster impositions, ID cards being but the latest outrage amongst the many preceeding , I might add.
.
Posted by: Davy, Erskine on 6:25am Fri 7 Mar 08
With Westminsters track record on losing information via discs and/or laptops do they really think that anyone in their right mind could trust them with I.D. cards.
You might as well post all your secure info onto the internet, bank details included now, and get it over and done with.
Alex is bang on the nail with this, everyone should have very, very serious concerns.
With Westminsters track record on losing information via discs and/or laptops do they really think that anyone in their right mind could trust them with I.D. cards.
You might as well post all your secure info onto the internet, bank details included now, and get it over and done with.
Alex is bang on the nail with this, everyone should have very, very serious concerns.
Posted by: Cadgers, Perth on 7:02am Fri 7 Mar 08
""enjoy the two key benefits of the National Identity Scheme - improved protection and greater convenience".".....
My nether regions!!
""enjoy the two key benefits of the National Identity Scheme - improved protection and greater convenience".".....
My nether regions!!
Posted by: Hebb, Scotia on 7:29am Fri 7 Mar 08
Graham, Glasgow on 2:15am today
[quote]No worry Tesco will manage it![/quote]
The ultimate loyalty card for the mentally colonised:
the Union Dividend Card.
Collect [italic]Brownie[/italic] points for selling out the Scottish interest at every opportunity. At no extra cost you can break the law and gain bonus points (Gold membership of this scheme is available to Labour Party MSPs).
Graham, Glasgow on 2:15am today
No worry Tesco will manage it!
The ultimate loyalty card for the mentally colonised:
the Union Dividend Card.
Collect
Brownie points for selling out the Scottish interest at every opportunity. At no extra cost you can break the law and gain bonus points (Gold membership of this scheme is available to Labour Party MSPs).
Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 7:48am Fri 7 Mar 08
What's the big problem with id cards? Forget the civil liberties guff. The government knows everything about you anyway, it just makes sense to have it all in one place.
Nothing to hide - nothing to fear.
I think it's a great idea.
What's the big problem with id cards? Forget the civil liberties guff. The government knows everything about you anyway, it just makes sense to have it all in one place.
Nothing to hide - nothing to fear.
I think it's a great idea.
Posted by: Lobeydosser, Woodlands Road on 7:48am Fri 7 Mar 08
Heavens, you guys were up early this morning, were you on the night shift?
The whole national ID card thing is a complete mess.
1. Goverment Computer disks missing with personal data lost...how secure will future data be... open to ID fraud.
2. Bio metric data: how will the system extract dna from me without 'violating' me, and what happens if I refuse, will I be held down and some one shove a probe somewhere dark & wet?? Also is that not akin to torture?
3. Why should those from out side the EU who have Indefinite Leave to Remain, be treated separately; many of them are in highly skilled jobs. This is xenophobia at its extreme.
4. We already have ID cards to an extent; mentioned earlier anyone with a new driving licence has in effect an ID card; Banks already ask for ID such as this along with your bank card.
I watched 'V for Vendetta' the other night which reminded me of the Orwellian world we are sleep walking towards and I prefer Ian Paisleys repost and the last 3 lines of a Churchill speach which I think is apst for thie ID cards:
[bold]Never, never, never![/bold]
Heavens, you guys were up early this morning, were you on the night shift?
The whole national ID card thing is a complete mess.
1. Goverment Computer disks missing with personal data lost...how secure will future data be... open to ID fraud.
2. Bio metric data: how will the system extract dna from me without 'violating' me, and what happens if I refuse, will I be held down and some one shove a probe somewhere dark & wet?? Also is that not akin to torture?
3. Why should those from out side the EU who have Indefinite Leave to Remain, be treated separately; many of them are in highly skilled jobs. This is xenophobia at its extreme.
4. We already have ID cards to an extent; mentioned earlier anyone with a new driving licence has in effect an ID card; Banks already ask for ID such as this along with your bank card.
I watched 'V for Vendetta' the other night which reminded me of the Orwellian world we are sleep walking towards and I prefer Ian Paisleys repost and the last 3 lines of a Churchill speach which I think is apst for thie ID cards:
Never, never, never!
Posted by: alison, Aberdeenshire on 7:51am Fri 7 Mar 08
Good for you Alex, - no ID cards in Scotland!!
Good for you Alex, - no ID cards in Scotland!!
Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 7:52am Fri 7 Mar 08
Alex? Personal friend is he?
Alex? Personal friend is he?
Posted by: Corrupt EU, Fife on 7:53am Fri 7 Mar 08
No need. I won't be registering. Besides, I want to have a confrontation with this Nazi government. They need to be exposed as such.
"live free or die"
No need. I won't be registering. Besides, I want to have a confrontation with this Nazi government. They need to be exposed as such.
"live free or die"
Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 7:56am Fri 7 Mar 08
You'll find that many countries in Europe have national id cards. Hardy 'Nazi' are they?
I wish people wouldn't use throw away words like that without thinking.
You'll find that many countries in Europe have national id cards. Hardy 'Nazi' are they?
I wish people wouldn't use throw away words like that without thinking.
Posted by: Cambiblue, Glasgow on 7:56am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
The Scottish government makes decisions on behalf of the people of Scotland according to the will of the people of Scotland. Full stop. [/quote] But only on devolved matters like street sweeping and refuse collection
Los Angeles wrote:
The Scottish government makes decisions on behalf of the people of Scotland according to the will of the people of Scotland. Full stop.
But only on devolved matters like street sweeping and refuse collection
Posted by: David B, Larkhall on 7:56am Fri 7 Mar 08
LA
[quote]they want elves, leprechauns, zombies, and Father Christmas to have one too[/quote]
Depends whether Santa comes from Lapland or the N Pole. But presently the leprechauns won't need them cos they are from inside the EU. Some of the elves and zombies will need the, particularly the ones starting degree courses, or losing your luggage at the airport.
But it seems to me a bit strange that the cards will be compulsory for non EU nationals first. How can anyone spot a non EU national? Unless they register as such with the authorities then officialdom won't know. If they are illegals ( and I think its sort of implied that one of the benefits is of being able to keep them out ) I doubt very much they are going to flock to register. So how are they going to be identified?
Are our police going to stop everyone and ask them to prove ID? Will they be asked to bring the proof with them to the nearest copshop in 14 days? The illegals and ID fraudsters will be right there I'll bet - Not.
I carry a few plastic cards, very rarely forget to have them with me, but from originally having no great concern about the ID cards, I now just think this is a farce. A waste of taxpayers money which will achieve nothing of any value.
They should abandon the project and stop wasting our money.
LA
they want elves, leprechauns, zombies, and Father Christmas to have one too
Depends whether Santa comes from Lapland or the N Pole. But presently the leprechauns won't need them cos they are from inside the EU. Some of the elves and zombies will need the, particularly the ones starting degree courses, or losing your luggage at the airport.
But it seems to me a bit strange that the cards will be compulsory for non EU nationals first. How can anyone spot a non EU national? Unless they register as such with the authorities then officialdom won't know. If they are illegals ( and I think its sort of implied that one of the benefits is of being able to keep them out ) I doubt very much they are going to flock to register. So how are they going to be identified?
Are our police going to stop everyone and ask them to prove ID? Will they be asked to bring the proof with them to the nearest copshop in 14 days? The illegals and ID fraudsters will be right there I'll bet - Not.
I carry a few plastic cards, very rarely forget to have them with me, but from originally having no great concern about the ID cards, I now just think this is a farce. A waste of taxpayers money which will achieve nothing of any value.
They should abandon the project and stop wasting our money.
Posted by: Vronsky, Scotland on 7:58am Fri 7 Mar 08
Good for Alex - let's tell them where to shove it. Not a bad locus for massive civil disobedience if they try to go ahead.
It should all have been killed stone dead by the LSE report - see here:
tinyurl.com/7vlxp
Good for Alex - let's tell them where to shove it. Not a bad locus for massive civil disobedience if they try to go ahead.
It should all have been killed stone dead by the LSE report - see here:
tinyurl.com/7vlxp
Posted by: Oscar on 7:59am Fri 7 Mar 08
Outrageous, this is just Salmond doing what the people of Scotland want, [bold]DELIBERATELY!!!![/bold]
Outrageous, this is just Salmond doing what the people of Scotland want,
DELIBERATELY!!!! Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 8:02am Fri 7 Mar 08
In the far, distant future in an independent Scotland, the government decides that it is the interests of the nation for the people to carry a national identity card. Great idea! It's a Scottish identity card after all. How proud we would all be to have one.
In the far, distant future in an independent Scotland, the government decides that it is the interests of the nation for the people to carry a national identity card. Great idea! It's a Scottish identity card after all. How proud we would all be to have one.
Posted by: Astonished, Inverclyde on 8:11am Fri 7 Mar 08
How many brown envelopes are Labour getting for trying to push this through ?
Haggis and Short of brain - Did you get a brown envelope ?
I do not want to live in a country where a policeman can ask "Where are your papers ?". NEVER,NEVER,NEVER (with thanks to lobeydosser)
How many brown envelopes are Labour getting for trying to push this through ?
Haggis and Short of brain - Did you get a brown envelope ?
I do not want to live in a country where a policeman can ask "Where are your papers ?". NEVER,NEVER,NEVER (with thanks to lobeydosser)
Posted by: Humbug, Athame on 8:15am Fri 7 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Los Angeles[/bold] wrote:
8% Idiot 92% Moron[quote]I note these trade stats show[/quote] Go away, you tosspot. We know you don't believe a single thing about the crapola, humbug, and puerile guff you keep posting. [/quote] Kindly don't use my name when posting insults.
Los Angeles wrote:
8% Idiot 92% MoronI note these trade stats show
Go away, you tosspot. We know you don't believe a single thing about the crapola, humbug, and puerile guff you keep posting.
Kindly don't use my name when posting insults.
Posted by: spagan, heisker, scotland on 8:19am Fri 7 Mar 08
Astonished - you are of course quite correct!
David (lock up you daughters) Blunkett is always defending the introduction of ID cards. What he doesn't give away is how much he gets from the companies who are "delivering" the technology.
Another ex-Labour minister, another snout in another trough.
I wonder if his Labradoodle needs an ID card?
Astonished - you are of course quite correct!
David (lock up you daughters) Blunkett is always defending the introduction of ID cards. What he doesn't give away is how much he gets from the companies who are "delivering" the technology.
Another ex-Labour minister, another snout in another trough.
I wonder if his Labradoodle needs an ID card?
Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 8:22am Fri 7 Mar 08
Every time I post a comment I get an insult in return. I don't feel the need to insult any of you - althought it would be very easy for me to do so. Your comments speak volumes about you.
Every time I post a comment I get an insult in return. I don't feel the need to insult any of you - althought it would be very easy for me to do so. Your comments speak volumes about you.
Posted by: JohnJ, Edinburgh on 8:26am Fri 7 Mar 08
The actual ID cards are a red herring, the government wants the database that will be compiled on every soul in the country.
After all the majority of terrorist acts in the UK (and US) have been carried out by people who were using their own legitimate identity, most held a UK passport and and would have been eligible for an ID card. How would this legislation have stopped them ?
The actual ID cards are a red herring, the government wants the database that will be compiled on every soul in the country.
After all the majority of terrorist acts in the UK (and US) have been carried out by people who were using their own legitimate identity, most held a UK passport and and would have been eligible for an ID card. How would this legislation have stopped them ?
Posted by: Haggis & Shortbread, Glasgow on 8:27am Fri 7 Mar 08
Every time I post a comment I get an insult in return. I don't feel the need to insult any of you - althought it would be very easy for me to do so. Your comments speak volumes about you.
Every time I post a comment I get an insult in return. I don't feel the need to insult any of you - althought it would be very easy for me to do so. Your comments speak volumes about you.
Posted by: Humbug, Athame on 8:28am Fri 7 Mar 08
Can't wait for them to be introduced and then sit back and watch the fun .
The inept bureaucrats will do the job for Alex.
Can't wait for them to be introduced and then sit back and watch the fun .
The inept bureaucrats will do the job for Alex.
Posted by: Luigi, Aberdeen on 9:02am Fri 7 Mar 08
I'm wearing my "Optimist" hat again, but there does seem to be an opportunity here to inflict significant damage on Brown. I'm not sure how Salmond will play this but I really hope that the Lib Dems support him. He should force their hand. After all, this is an issue that should be very very close to their hearts.
Brown reminds me of one of those huge "unsinkable" Japanese battleships of WW2. Keep hitting him hard and, eventually, he will go down.
I'm wearing my "Optimist" hat again, but there does seem to be an opportunity here to inflict significant damage on Brown. I'm not sure how Salmond will play this but I really hope that the Lib Dems support him. He should force their hand. After all, this is an issue that should be very very close to their hearts.
Brown reminds me of one of those huge "unsinkable" Japanese battleships of WW2. Keep hitting him hard and, eventually, he will go down.
Posted by: Wen D, Inversnecky on 9:09am Fri 7 Mar 08
This will be inroduced by stealth! Mr bean has stated that it will kick off when one applies for a passport. I see a constitutional crisis arising when a Scot is refused a passport because he does not comply with Beans conditions for obtaining one.
The Scots govt will rightly complain to the UN that its citizens are being refused the right to travel by a foreign power!
Interesting times ahead!
This will be inroduced by stealth! Mr bean has stated that it will kick off when one applies for a passport. I see a constitutional crisis arising when a Scot is refused a passport because he does not comply with Beans conditions for obtaining one.
The Scots govt will rightly complain to the UN that its citizens are being refused the right to travel by a foreign power!
Interesting times ahead!
Posted by: The Voice of Reason, Blairgowrie on 9:10am Fri 7 Mar 08
Alex, why are you always trying to pick a fight with Westminster? If, like Jack, Henry and dare I say St. Donald, you keep schtoomb (?)and do nowt then these ridiculous laws can get through with minimal fuss.
What personal price will you pay for rebelling against Daily Mail induced British xenophobia when Lordships are dished out to reward the silent? Think about it Lord Salmond of Lake Ness and £60K netto for the rest of your days, just to swallow your silly pride in your wee country and follow the Oldham/Bradford lead to colourful fun. You know it makes sense.
VoR
Alex, why are you always trying to pick a fight with Westminster? If, like Jack, Henry and dare I say St. Donald, you keep schtoomb (?)and do nowt then these ridiculous laws can get through with minimal fuss.
What personal price will you pay for rebelling against Daily Mail induced British xenophobia when Lordships are dished out to reward the silent? Think about it Lord Salmond of Lake Ness and £60K netto for the rest of your days, just to swallow your silly pride in your wee country and follow the Oldham/Bradford lead to colourful fun. You know it makes s