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Where have all the Labour socialists gone?
Watching Charlie Gordon MSP on the TV recently, reminded me of a young man, of the same name, I used to know. Two decades ago I was acquainted with a young, energetic and committed socialist who represented rail workers on the Glasgow Trades Council.
That young man was nobody's
fall-guy: he was alert, intelligent and highly motivated, and I was pleased to count him among my socialist comrades. I recall how hard he worked to raise money for the miners' families during their bitter struggle. None of us then, including Charlie, could go to friends who could write out a cheque for £1000 (sorry, £950) for the miners' children. Indeed, if we could get friends who could donate £10 we were delighted.
I can just imagine what that young man would have thought about an MSP who could solicit hundreds of pounds from "friends" for "political" causes, while being ignorant of the laws governing such donations. Charlie would have torn that "explanation" apart with wit and sarcasm.
Also, the young Charlie I knew would have opposed bitterly the New Labour right-wing clique that has taken over the Labour Party; he would certainly not have been working to get its leader elected to front the party in Scotland.
I wonder where that Charlie has gone. Come to think of it, I wonder where the Labour Party has gone.
Andy Anderson,
Eadar Dà Allt, 22 Earlish,
Near Portree, Skye.
Why do politicians north and south of the border still think that "acting in good faith" is an acceptable excuse for illegal activity? Starting with Tony Blair and others, MSPs Tom McCabe and Charlie Gordon are just the latest to put up this weak defence for actions that were clearly in breach of the law introduced by their own party to control the source and amount of payments to political parties.
Ignorance of the law is no excuse; Scottish voters are not stupid and will not be fooled by their excuses. Unfortunately, as things stand it will be several years before we can make our views known through the ballot box. So here is a suggestion for First Minister Alex Salmond. He should announce an executive decision to cancel the Edinburgh trams project on the grounds that the miserly grant increase of 0.5% from the Treasury means the scheme can no longer be afforded. When the opposition parties rise up in united outrage, challenge them to table a vote of confidence motion on the issue.
If they do so and win the vote, the government will fall and there will be another Scottish election. This will give voters the chance to punish Labour for its underhand actions
and its poor performance in
opposition (and also, perhaps, the LibDems for causing the minority government situation by stubbornly refusing even to talk to the SNP about a possible coalition).
If the opposition lose the vote, the authority of the SNP government will be greatly strengthened and there will be another £500m to spend on more worthwhile causes.
The same outcome would arise if Labour refused to table a confidence motion and it would lose what
little credibility it still has as a principled opposition.
Iain A D Mann,
7 Kelvin Court, Glasgow.
Douglas brought us the election shambles; Wendy has brought us the donations shambles. The Alexander siblings are, we are told, the huge brains of Scottish Labour. The frightening thing for Labour
supporters is that that may be true.
Professor Ian Brown,
New Balghoulan,
5 Fenton Terrace, Pitlochry.
Surely now is the time for your regular correspondent Alex Gallacher from Largs to come forward and take up the leadership of the Scottish Labour Party. If there was ever a time when the Labour Party in Scotland needed completely blind, unquestioning leadership, it must be now.
I, and tens of thousands of Scots across the land, are awaiting urgently his information on how the scandals that are currently besetting the Labour leadership are all the SNP's fault and yet another reason to forget independence and leave our trust and future in the hands of their equally dodgy colleagues at Westminster. The nation awaits.
Provost Celia Lawson,
Renfrewshire Council,
Cotton Street, Paisley.
Labour told us things could only get better. But nearly a decade after Communities Minister Wendy Alexander issued a document that promised us "a Scotland in which every person both contrabutes sic to and benefits from the community in which they live", she is caught issuing a thank-you letter to a Labour donor who prefers the fiscal autonomy enjoyed by Jersey to Britain under Gordon Brown. And she still can't spell for toffee. There is no "d" in "priviledged". Her "d" should have been in "declaration".
Neil Robertson,
4 Glamis Terrace, Dundee.
In his Saturday Essay, Ian Bell suggested that some people might consider Nye Bevan to have been "a vain, vindictive neurotic", albeit he gave us the NHS in 1948.
Although I had the pleasure of hearing Nye Bevan speak at a public meeting in Leith town hall many years ago, I didn't know him well enough over the years to come to a view about his personality or mental state. What I would say, however, is that, if the price of achieving such a transformation of society and the unparalleled improvement in the wellbeing of Britain's working class is to have to endure a vain and neurotic politician, then I would happily pay that price.
And when one looks at the political state of health of post-war Britain with the position we are in today, one would have to conclude we are (still) surrounded by vain politicians on all sides; the country is being led by someone who, it is alleged, is "psychologically flawed"; but there is no sign of any fundamental improvement for the people of Britain comparable to Nye Bevan's. I would settle for Nye any day of the week.
Bill Stewart,
Earnville, Dunning, Perthshire.
Why is anyone surprised that the Labour Party is being questioned about its probity? The party, in central Scotland at least, has been corrupt for years. I do not mean by this that all its members are a bunch of crooks (although there are a small number of dishonest politicians in the mix).
The corruption that I mean is the corruption that is the automatic consequence of the single-party state that central Scottish politics has "enjoyed" in recent decades. The majority of councillors and MSPs would be horrified if they were accused individually of corruption.
That is the whole point of this letter. The processes within Labour governance have become corrupt over time in a slow drift - an inevitable drift, given the overwhelming dominance of the party. Humans are lazy and will take short-cuts. Short-cuts become the accepted norm and, slowly, corrupt practices grow without the participants being aware of it. This is the real message of the current stories.
There is much more to be revealed: how committee positions are appointed; how money is given or withheld to leverage political influence; secret deals of all sorts. It will be interesting to see whether the fourth estate finally is willing to develop its knowledge of these practices and do its job by publishing their stories.
Alan Arnott,
16 Newmilns Gardens, Blantyre.
Perhaps after they've dealt with
the guilty prosecutions for the illegal donations, the authorities will get around to prosecuting the guilty for the illegal war. And there's no mystery about where the cheques came from for that campaign.
Ruth Marr,
99 Grampian Road, Stirling.
It seemed like a good idea at the time. When Labour introduced legislation banning donations from UK non-residents, it had a healthy membership and the open coffers of the unions, as well as some wealthy resident donors. Some folk thought the timing, before a Scottish election, was intended to scupper the SNP's hope of a sizeable donation from Sir Sean Connery. A touch of schadenfreude is perhaps excusable.
Charlotte Atherton,
5A India Street, Edinburgh.
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Posted by: BM, Glasgow on 12:17am Mon 3 Dec 07
Not "where have they gone?" but "where will they go?" The Bar L, most likely.
Not "where have they gone?" but "where will they go?" The Bar L, most likely.
Posted by: John J. Sheridan, Z'ha'dum on 12:19am Mon 3 Dec 07
[quote]Provost Celia Lawson[/quote]
Hear, hear.
Where are you Alex, this small part of the nation awaits your sycophantic, knee-creeping warbling?
You must be able to spin this fiasco, you have had enough practise.
Provost Celia Lawson
Hear, hear.
Where are you Alex, this small part of the nation awaits your sycophantic, knee-creeping warbling?
You must be able to spin this fiasco, you have had enough practise.
Posted by: Von Paulus, STALINGRAD on 12:56am Mon 3 Dec 07
Today men Alex Gallagher is with me in Stalingrad.
We have been told to stand to the last
I FULLY EXPECT ALEX GALLAGHER TO BE THE LAST LABOURER STANDING IN THE AYR OF THIS COLD RUSSIAN WINTER
Today men Alex Gallagher is with me in Stalingrad.
We have been told to stand to the last
I FULLY EXPECT ALEX GALLAGHER TO BE THE LAST LABOURER STANDING IN THE AYR OF THIS COLD RUSSIAN WINTER
Posted by: LANG SPIN, carluke/fife on 4:43am Mon 3 Dec 07
To The Editor ( and could he be given the opportunity of actually seeing this?)
I dont expect it to be published so here goes
"I am both saddened and a little angry at The Herald, a publication I had come to admire
and respect. There is a palpable smell of spin as your paper is desperately trying to
cleanse itself from the nauseating air of self-righteousness in shopping Ms Alexander for
£900. Puffed-chest headlines proclaiming how good thou art for exposing Ms Alexander to
the calumny of the righteous for £900 will not give you grace. Rather, there is nothing
more sinister in Scotland than the sneer on the face of the zealous unco guid. Big
tackety bits aimed at the neeb are not worn only by the unwashed.
Your entire editorial staff will in time be ashamed for destroying a woman of uncommon
talent and commitment to Scotland. For £900? "
D**n the unco guid who will not see themselves. Nor do they see the unctuous grimace of Osbourne and Cameron who backed by AShcroft of Belize and £30 million political pocket money will buy England and parts of Scotland . And they will spit in the face of we jocks who sought to be great wi backhanders o £900. Not ta word will be uttered by the unco guid. Aye but for £900 y'll burn Wendy and smile.
To The Editor ( and could he be given the opportunity of actually seeing this?)
I dont expect it to be published so here goes
"I am both saddened and a little angry at The Herald, a publication I had come to admire
and respect. There is a palpable smell of spin as your paper is desperately trying to
cleanse itself from the nauseating air of self-righteousness in shopping Ms Alexander for
£900. Puffed-chest headlines proclaiming how good thou art for exposing Ms Alexander to
the calumny of the righteous for £900 will not give you grace. Rather, there is nothing
more sinister in Scotland than the sneer on the face of the zealous unco guid. Big
tackety bits aimed at the neeb are not worn only by the unwashed.
Your entire editorial staff will in time be ashamed for destroying a woman of uncommon
talent and commitment to Scotland. For £900? "
D**n the unco guid who will not see themselves. Nor do they see the unctuous grimace of Osbourne and Cameron who backed by AShcroft of Belize and £30 million political pocket money will buy England and parts of Scotland . And they will spit in the face of we jocks who sought to be great wi backhanders o £900. Not ta word will be uttered by the unco guid. Aye but for £900 y'll burn Wendy and smile.
Posted by: Jaggy on 5:57am Mon 3 Dec 07
McLeish (Officegate), McConnell (Red Rose) and now Alexander. Three Scottish leaders in a row engulfed by the sickly smell of corruption.
I could go on to mention other denizens of Labour's West of Scotland rotten burghs ... people like Gordon or Mosson ... but that would be superfluous.
The Scottish Labour party is rotten to the core and has been for some time.
McLeish (Officegate), McConnell (Red Rose) and now Alexander. Three Scottish leaders in a row engulfed by the sickly smell of corruption.
I could go on to mention other denizens of Labour's West of Scotland rotten burghs ... people like Gordon or Mosson ... but that would be superfluous.
The Scottish Labour party is rotten to the core and has been for some time.
Posted by: tom mciver, San Diego, California on 6:57am Mon 3 Dec 07
In 1996 the GDC dug up Candleriggs and relaid it as it is today. We who lived and/or worked there were told it was to be a pedestrian precinct with vehicle access for residential and business use only. Who told us this? Charles Gordon. Many months of noisy, dusty disruption followed and we lived through it in the knowledge that it would all be ok in the end. And (other than the bit about it being a pedestrian precinct) it was. The money came from the EEC and Commisioner Neil Kinnock was to cut the ribbon or whatever once it was completed. Another two days of having pneumatic drills digging up the newly laid paving stones outside my window resulted in an expensive big brass plaque being laid telling the world that Neil opened the street. Fair enough. But he didn't. Bad weather meant he didn't turn up and there was no ceremony. A couple of months later I was once more wakened early by the drills. This time the plaque was removed, only to be replaced a few days later by another- this time bearing the name of Charles Gordon. At great expense to the people of Glasgow (to say nothing of the annoyance and inconvenience to the residents and businesses of Candleriggs) the self-serving arrogance of Charles Gordon was laid in brass. I'd love to know just how much it cost. I wonder if he solicited donations.....
In 1996 the GDC dug up Candleriggs and relaid it as it is today. We who lived and/or worked there were told it was to be a pedestrian precinct with vehicle access for residential and business use only. Who told us this? Charles Gordon. Many months of noisy, dusty disruption followed and we lived through it in the knowledge that it would all be ok in the end. And (other than the bit about it being a pedestrian precinct) it was. The money came from the EEC and Commisioner Neil Kinnock was to cut the ribbon or whatever once it was completed. Another two days of having pneumatic drills digging up the newly laid paving stones outside my window resulted in an expensive big brass plaque being laid telling the world that Neil opened the street. Fair enough. But he didn't. Bad weather meant he didn't turn up and there was no ceremony. A couple of months later I was once more wakened early by the drills. This time the plaque was removed, only to be replaced a few days later by another- this time bearing the name of Charles Gordon. At great expense to the people of Glasgow (to say nothing of the annoyance and inconvenience to the residents and businesses of Candleriggs) the self-serving arrogance of Charles Gordon was laid in brass. I'd love to know just how much it cost. I wonder if he solicited donations.....
Posted by: Jack, Glasgow on 8:10am Mon 3 Dec 07
I am a member of the Labour Party. (there, that was the easy bit) I have to state that I am in for the long haul! I expect other socialists, like me, who have been silenced and ignored, (it's no longer fashionable to believe that the strong look after the weak, nor honesty and itegrity are pre-requisites for a political or a board room life, but above all -honour and doing whats right rather than whats fashionable or profitable) to awaken from our imposed exile. I am neither Old Labour nor New Labour but only Ordinary,Died in the Wool , Socialist leaning Labour! I hope that the worm has turned, that the get rich, not too well educated luvvy darling teenage sycophants have had their moment in the sun. Their 15minutes are up! Labour lost its way eventually with Blair, and unfortunately Brown never got the Charts for his current voyage through politics. The Labour Titanic has well and truly foundered, last to leave won't be Brown, he'll be ditched overboard in a last gasp attempt at regaining the populist vote! I have absolutely no problem in accepting that Brown is an honest man, he's just not a very good politician. The Labour Party no longer wants to represent "ordinary" people. It wants sycophants, rich list B actors, and Sun reading nurds. All thinking persons please find another party to vote for. I didn't vote for the vast majority of people in power in my Party. They voted themselves in. So, people with some moral fibre, who believe in other people doing whats right, who want a strong industrial Britain, a real wage for our citizens, a health service worthy of its name (Doctors who join up to make money as their prime motivator - have just picked the wrong profession - health service desk bound managers better find something else to do, we don't need them). New Labour are heading for oblivion at the polls. The next Conservative Government will asset strip what they didn't have the balls to take last time around, (make no mistake - that's whats on the cards, maybe Cameron can recoup some of the £billion that he lost whilst at Carlton) So....time to come back lads, show the public that real people exist in the party, we can't and won't turn back the clock to the bad old days and badder practices!! But we can take the reins of a party that looks after everyones interests as best it can, that will look after the weak, the old, the infirm the unloved or the merely inconvenient. The strong the big and the businessman. We need all of you! We need to take our Party back!
I am a member of the Labour Party. (there, that was the easy bit) I have to state that I am in for the long haul! I expect other socialists, like me, who have been silenced and ignored, (it's no longer fashionable to believe that the strong look after the weak, nor honesty and itegrity are pre-requisites for a political or a board room life, but above all -honour and doing whats right rather than whats fashionable or profitable) to awaken from our imposed exile. I am neither Old Labour nor New Labour but only Ordinary,Died in the Wool , Socialist leaning Labour! I hope that the worm has turned, that the get rich, not too well educated luvvy darling teenage sycophants have had their moment in the sun. Their 15minutes are up! Labour lost its way eventually with Blair, and unfortunately Brown never got the Charts for his current voyage through politics. The Labour Titanic has well and truly foundered, last to leave won't be Brown, he'll be ditched overboard in a last gasp attempt at regaining the populist vote! I have absolutely no problem in accepting that Brown is an honest man, he's just not a very good politician. The Labour Party no longer wants to represent "ordinary" people. It wants sycophants, rich list B actors, and Sun reading nurds. All thinking persons please find another party to vote for. I didn't vote for the vast majority of people in power in my Party. They voted themselves in. So, people with some moral fibre, who believe in other people doing whats right, who want a strong industrial Britain, a real wage for our citizens, a health service worthy of its name (Doctors who join up to make money as their prime motivator - have just picked the wrong profession - health service desk bound managers better find something else to do, we don't need them). New Labour are heading for oblivion at the polls. The next Conservative Government will asset strip what they didn't have the balls to take last time around, (make no mistake - that's whats on the cards, maybe Cameron can recoup some of the £billion that he lost whilst at Carlton) So....time to come back lads, show the public that real people exist in the party, we can't and won't turn back the clock to the bad old days and badder practices!! But we can take the reins of a party that looks after everyones interests as best it can, that will look after the weak, the old, the infirm the unloved or the merely inconvenient. The strong the big and the businessman. We need all of you! We need to take our Party back!
Posted by: Giftie gie us, Hunterston on 9:53am Mon 3 Dec 07
It would bring tears to a glass eye, so it would. I refer, of course, to the cri-de-coeur for "Comical Alex" frae Largs to assume a New Labour leadership role. Cometh the hour, cometh the ...zombie, the great undead himself. I hear the billows roar as he unfastens himself from that rock at Fairlie.
However, some still don't get it for "myth" has a durable quality. One such is that Brown is an honest man gone awry, when de facto he was the principal architect in the construct called New Labour, a sell-out to big business led by Brown. When Mandelson said that New Labour was "intensely relaxed about people becoming filthy rich" he spoke for the Chancer aka Chancellor who made it all possible.
New Labour as a political force is finished, terminated by its own hubris. As it sits amidst the wreckage this morning, it might usefully reconsder Mandelson's adage, starting with what "riches" actually connotes. Comical Alex will surely have a homily on this and we await its delivery.
It would bring tears to a glass eye, so it would. I refer, of course, to the cri-de-coeur for "Comical Alex" frae Largs to assume a New Labour leadership role. Cometh the hour, cometh the ...zombie, the great undead himself. I hear the billows roar as he unfastens himself from that rock at Fairlie.
However, some still don't get it for "myth" has a durable quality. One such is that Brown is an honest man gone awry, when de facto he was the principal architect in the construct called New Labour, a sell-out to big business led by Brown. When Mandelson said that New Labour was "intensely relaxed about people becoming filthy rich" he spoke for the Chancer aka Chancellor who made it all possible.
New Labour as a political force is finished, terminated by its own hubris. As it sits amidst the wreckage this morning, it might usefully reconsder Mandelson's adage, starting with what "riches" actually connotes. Comical Alex will surely have a homily on this and we await its delivery.
Posted by: John Jamieson, Glasgow on 10:25am Mon 3 Dec 07
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.
Posted by: MisterC, Glasgow on 10:29am Mon 3 Dec 07
Why stop with Alex Gallacher as leader, perhaps Labours dream ticket could be him and the legendary Doug Maughan, who after all is used to having his heads in and above the clouds
Why stop with Alex Gallacher as leader, perhaps Labours dream ticket could be him and the legendary Doug Maughan, who after all is used to having his heads in and above the clouds
Posted by: Jim on 11:04am Mon 3 Dec 07
Iain A D Mann, what an excellent idea. I have long been of the opinion that the SNP should do something along these lines to force a new election. Labour would be terrified of such a prospect , and the SNP would have everyrthing to gain.
Iain A D Mann, what an excellent idea. I have long been of the opinion that the SNP should do something along these lines to force a new election. Labour would be terrified of such a prospect , and the SNP would have everyrthing to gain.
Posted by: G Wright, Glasgow UK on 11:24am Mon 3 Dec 07
To Andy Anderson, who once knew Charlie Gordon:
I read our letter with a wry smile. Socialism is a cancer, when will you realise?. Socialists are only good socialists when they have no power. Once they have power, they abandon their principles and have their snouts in the trough, while taxing everyone else to death.
The pattern has been repeated, globally, through history.
Socialism is a bogus creed the working class use to propel themselves into positions of power, as opposed to getting there through talent. They use their fellow workers as a ladder, feeding them bogus promises in return for votes.
It seems Socialism is pretty much dead on these shores, save for your remote outpost in Skye, Mr Anderson. Cant say I will miss it.
To Andy Anderson, who once knew Charlie Gordon:
I read our letter with a wry smile. Socialism is a cancer, when will you realise?. Socialists are only good socialists when they have no power. Once they have power, they abandon their principles and have their snouts in the trough, while taxing everyone else to death.
The pattern has been repeated, globally, through history.
Socialism is a bogus creed the working class use to propel themselves into positions of power, as opposed to getting there through talent. They use their fellow workers as a ladder, feeding them bogus promises in return for votes.
It seems Socialism is pretty much dead on these shores, save for your remote outpost in Skye, Mr Anderson. Cant say I will miss it.
Posted by: Giftie gie us, Hunterston on 11:29am Mon 3 Dec 07
I continue to hear "Comical Alex" roaring from his rock at Fairlie. Deliverance is at hand and he'll be with us shortly.
To John Jamieson: anent an apposite 5-letter name for a sum "just under one thousand pounds". I got the name straight off because I'm smart with these things: it is of course a "W....anky"! Jesus wept.
I continue to hear "Comical Alex" roaring from his rock at Fairlie. Deliverance is at hand and he'll be with us shortly.
To John Jamieson: anent an apposite 5-letter name for a sum "just under one thousand pounds". I got the name straight off because I'm smart with these things: it is of course a "W....anky"! Jesus wept.
Posted by: widsum power, Airdrie on 11:44am Mon 3 Dec 07
To the ubiquitous G Wright aka G Wrong. Whatever else has "died on these shores" it isn't "socialism". A "cancer" indeed: how imaginative! Blair and Brown aren't socialists - they are mass murderers. And they are Tories like G Wrong. Their god is money. They are thankfully a joke, a condition which G Wrong knows only too well and from which he has long been afflicted. "Talent" - what, for heaven's sake, does G Wrong know of that, he who talks only mince on a daily basis?
To the ubiquitous G Wright aka G Wrong. Whatever else has "died on these shores" it isn't "socialism". A "cancer" indeed: how imaginative! Blair and Brown aren't socialists - they are mass murderers. And they are Tories like G Wrong. Their god is money. They are thankfully a joke, a condition which G Wrong knows only too well and from which he has long been afflicted. "Talent" - what, for heaven's sake, does G Wrong know of that, he who talks only mince on a daily basis?
Posted by: John J. Sheridan, Z'ha'dum on 11:56am Mon 3 Dec 07
Still waiting Alex.
Or what about you Doug?
You both always have so much critical analysis to hand the rest of the time.
Why is this different?
Shall l tell you why?
It's because in keeping with the spirit of the party you support you are cowards when it comes to the crunch.
Like wee wendy or the big clunking fist you prefer to hide until you think it is safe to come out into the light.
You and people like you have allowed a party to be stolen from those who created it, you allowed, no positively roared on the theft of a peoples party by self serving climbers like Blair, Mandelson and the Alexander's.
You have much to say and sneer about when the going is good (in your minds) but not too much bravado when the rotten underbelly of what you have helped create is exposed to the light of day.
YOU gave these arrogant little toe rags power.
YOU actively support every double dealing bit of garbage they spout.
YOU agree with imperialist acts of murder clothed in the part respectability of the name WAR.
YOUR support for them is why our young lads are coming home in coffins or with lives and bodies wrecked.
You have so much to say for yourselves in your smug and arrogant way, so where are you now?
Come here and tell us about how honourable your glorious leader and her fellow pigs at the trough are, there to benefit the people of Scotland and how she will exonerated in the fullness of time.
I can't wait.
Still waiting Alex.
Or what about you Doug?
You both always have so much critical analysis to hand the rest of the time.
Why is this different?
Shall l tell you why?
It's because in keeping with the spirit of the party you support you are cowards when it comes to the crunch.
Like wee wendy or the big clunking fist you prefer to hide until you think it is safe to come out into the light.
You and people like you have allowed a party to be stolen from those who created it, you allowed, no positively roared on the theft of a peoples party by self serving climbers like Blair, Mandelson and the Alexander's.
You have much to say and sneer about when the going is good (in your minds) but not too much bravado when the rotten underbelly of what you have helped create is exposed to the light of day.
YOU gave these arrogant little toe rags power.
YOU actively support every double dealing bit of garbage they spout.
YOU agree with imperialist acts of murder clothed in the part respectability of the name WAR.
YOUR support for them is why our young lads are coming home in coffins or with lives and bodies wrecked.
You have so much to say for yourselves in your smug and arrogant way, so where are you now?
Come here and tell us about how honourable your glorious leader and her fellow pigs at the trough are, there to benefit the people of Scotland and how she will exonerated in the fullness of time.
I can't wait.
Posted by: Alex, Glasgow on 1:51pm Mon 3 Dec 07
[quote][bold]John Jamieson[/bold] wrote:
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.[/quote] Great idea - what about a Gay (Gordon) - after the merry dance they have been leading us - or a Brandy (Alexander) - you need one to forget the abomination of New Labour
John Jamieson wrote:
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.
Great idea - what about a Gay (Gordon) - after the merry dance they have been leading us - or a Brandy (Alexander) - you need one to forget the abomination of New Labour
Posted by: "Comical Alex", frae Largs on 2:28pm Mon 3 Dec 07
Free at last. I'm standing where I am because I am here. My many fans have been calling for my appearance. Jean Paul Sartre said that most men lead a life of quiet desperation and this I can now confirm, excepting the "quiet" tag. As Fraser, my persona in Dad's Army puts it:"We are all doomed". As for the Wendy campaign funding analysis, this is available on www.personality disorder.com and is well worth the 20minute read. I see the sinister hand of Salmond in many of New Labour's curent travails, starting with the sabotaging of our votes from Arran back in May.But we will fight them on the beaches of Largs, in the lowlands of Monklands and in the wee sma' glen of Invercockieleekie Wewill rally our forces. Under our new Leader, Henry McLeish - more a catstophe than a fiddle - we will be back and how. Our motto will be "Only the lonely" can win the hearts and minds of the people of Scotia. This was my choice. There's a vote out there somewhere and we will find it, have no fear of that all you cowards who are sneering now but who will be cheering all too soon. Hail California....I mean Caledonia!
Free at last. I'm standing where I am because I am here. My many fans have been calling for my appearance. Jean Paul Sartre said that most men lead a life of quiet desperation and this I can now confirm, excepting the "quiet" tag. As Fraser, my persona in Dad's Army puts it:"We are all doomed". As for the Wendy campaign funding analysis, this is available on www.personality disorder.com and is well worth the 20minute read. I see the sinister hand of Salmond in many of New Labour's curent travails, starting with the sabotaging of our votes from Arran back in May.But we will fight them on the beaches of Largs, in the lowlands of Monklands and in the wee sma' glen of Invercockieleekie Wewill rally our forces. Under our new Leader, Henry McLeish - more a catstophe than a fiddle - we will be back and how. Our motto will be "Only the lonely" can win the hearts and minds of the people of Scotia. This was my choice. There's a vote out there somewhere and we will find it, have no fear of that all you cowards who are sneering now but who will be cheering all too soon. Hail California....I mean Caledonia!
Posted by: GLASWEGIAN, GLASGOW on 2:44pm Mon 3 Dec 07
jOHN jAMIESON
Just under £1,000? Surely it's got to be a WENDY?
jOHN jAMIESON
Just under £1,000? Surely it's got to be a WENDY?
Posted by: Giftie gie us, Hunterston on 3:02pm Mon 3 Dec 07
To Glaswegian, Glasgow
Sherlock Holmes said that when all other explanations fail go back to the obvious. But a "wendy" is just too unoriginal. I think that's why Mr Jamieson was more oblique, more droll. And that's why I offered "wanky" which has the additional merit of being risque besides being more long-lasting, n'est pas?
To Glaswegian, Glasgow
Sherlock Holmes said that when all other explanations fail go back to the obvious. But a "wendy" is just too unoriginal. I think that's why Mr Jamieson was more oblique, more droll. And that's why I offered "wanky" which has the additional merit of being risque besides being more long-lasting, n'est pas?
Posted by: Tom McAlister on 3:15pm Mon 3 Dec 07
.
Yeh, seconded. GLASWEGIAN< GLASGOW.
.
.
Yeh, seconded. GLASWEGIAN< GLASGOW.
.
Posted by: chris walker, west kilbride on 3:35pm Mon 3 Dec 07
Aside from all the sniggering and ribaldry there is one group of people for whom I feel genuine sympathy today. And Scotland has many of them. They are those socialists who have given their lives and their hopes to the Labour Party. Nothing stupid or naive about them. We had a cri-de-coeur from a Jack, Glasgow who must have spoken for many in an earlier posting. Nobody bothers about a silly wee Tory (G Wright) when he offers gauche but crocodile tears. But as a former Labour Party member, activist and parliamentary candidate, I care about the socialists. In the bottom line politics is visceral: it's about your tribe. The worst thing I can say about Blair and Brown et al is that they have destroyed the aspirations and clan loyalty of people like Jack. For what it's worth the clan has been extirpated: it's gone. What to do? Keynes put it this way: "When the facts change, I change. What do you do?"
Scotland is a democratically socialist country. Socialism goes with the grain of things here. It's part of our DNA. So, in this bleakest of times for people such as Jack, I'd say, "New Labour is too far gone to be changed, rotted from within by corruption and in spasm. It has become a carapace, an empty husk. The SNP is far from perfect but it offers the hope of something better for socialists. "Their life's blood dyed its every fold" once. Now the red flag lies limp with embarrassment. We must raise it elsewhere.
Aside from all the sniggering and ribaldry there is one group of people for whom I feel genuine sympathy today. And Scotland has many of them. They are those socialists who have given their lives and their hopes to the Labour Party. Nothing stupid or naive about them. We had a cri-de-coeur from a Jack, Glasgow who must have spoken for many in an earlier posting. Nobody bothers about a silly wee Tory (G Wright) when he offers gauche but crocodile tears. But as a former Labour Party member, activist and parliamentary candidate, I care about the socialists. In the bottom line politics is visceral: it's about your tribe. The worst thing I can say about Blair and Brown et al is that they have destroyed the aspirations and clan loyalty of people like Jack. For what it's worth the clan has been extirpated: it's gone. What to do? Keynes put it this way: "When the facts change, I change. What do you do?"
Scotland is a democratically socialist country. Socialism goes with the grain of things here. It's part of our DNA. So, in this bleakest of times for people such as Jack, I'd say, "New Labour is too far gone to be changed, rotted from within by corruption and in spasm. It has become a carapace, an empty husk. The SNP is far from perfect but it offers the hope of something better for socialists. "Their life's blood dyed its every fold" once. Now the red flag lies limp with embarrassment. We must raise it elsewhere.
Posted by: Andy, Edinburgh on 4:01pm Mon 3 Dec 07
"Now the red flag lies limp with embarrassment. We must raise it elsewhere." Do that and all you'll get is the same again - socialism doesn't work long-term - how many times do you need to see the truth before you're finally willing to accept it?!
G Wright hit the nail on the head - every time socialists get power, they use it for their own personal gain, taxing everyone else in the process, until ultimately it destroys them.
Sad, but true -socialism is only useful as an opposition, never in government.
"Now the red flag lies limp with embarrassment. We must raise it elsewhere." Do that and all you'll get is the same again - socialism doesn't work long-term - how many times do you need to see the truth before you're finally willing to accept it?!
G Wright hit the nail on the head - every time socialists get power, they use it for their own personal gain, taxing everyone else in the process, until ultimately it destroys them.
Sad, but true -socialism is only useful as an opposition, never in government.
Posted by: chris walker, west kilbride on 4:51pm Mon 3 Dec 07
If G Wright is "correct" it will be the first time in his life he's been correct about anything at all. Have you ever read anything he has said about a range of subjects? Have you ever spotted anything remotely erudite or even informed? I don't take lectures from anonymous posters, "Andy", especially with a narrative as infantile as yours.
If G Wright is "correct" it will be the first time in his life he's been correct about anything at all. Have you ever read anything he has said about a range of subjects? Have you ever spotted anything remotely erudite or even informed? I don't take lectures from anonymous posters, "Andy", especially with a narrative as infantile as yours.
Posted by: Huttcity, New Zealand on 10:28pm Mon 3 Dec 07
[quote][bold]GLASWEGIAN[/bold] wrote:
jOHN jAMIESON
Just under £1,000? Surely it's got to be a WENDY?[/quote] absolutely, I look forward to the day I have an opportunity to use it in conversation.
GLASWEGIAN wrote:
jOHN jAMIESON
Just under £1,000? Surely it's got to be a WENDY?
absolutely, I look forward to the day I have an opportunity to use it in conversation.
Posted by: Don Hunter, Ayr on 11:24pm Mon 3 Dec 07
Name: Joe Public
Charge: Theft
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Sentence: Jail
Name: Joe Public
Charge: Manslaughter
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Sentence: Jail
Name: Wendy Alexander
Charge: Illegal Political Donations
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Expected Sentence: 1 year in Corton Vale
Actual Sentence: Nothing - time to move on.
This will make a total mockery of the law of our country.
Name: Joe Public
Charge: Theft
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Sentence: Jail
Name: Joe Public
Charge: Manslaughter
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Sentence: Jail
Name: Wendy Alexander
Charge: Illegal Political Donations
Defense: It was me, but I did'nae mean it
Expected Sentence: 1 year in Corton Vale
Actual Sentence: Nothing - time to move on.
This will make a total mockery of the law of our country.
Posted by: Yok Finney, Ross-shire on 12:55am Tue 4 Dec 07
[quote]It's part of our DNA.[/quote]
i.e. the hardware of the brain?
As functioning software we can also dowload: capitalist, drug baron (sugar, coffee, tea, cannabis, cocaine, temarzapan, eccies - you call it), mercenary (join the army), lawyer, judge, psycopath (psychiatry - see also sas).
What next? shopping, tourism, property developers, golf courses?
We're a slow maturing general purpose animal so most software will work: you can be a rat, bear (alot in glasgow), tiger, climb up wall, climb up mountains, fly, rally 'n rock and roll. Most humans get set in their ways ~ age 13 and are then difficult to reprogram.
I run on pumaware developed by Sharon for my career in thinking, fun, frolics, design-engineering and boatbuilding. I am a [bold]socialist[/bold] with it.
It's part of our DNA.
i.e. the hardware of the brain?
As functioning software we can also dowload: capitalist, drug baron (sugar, coffee, tea, cannabis, cocaine, temarzapan, eccies - you call it), mercenary (join the army), lawyer, judge, psycopath (psychiatry - see also sas).
What next? shopping, tourism, property developers, golf courses?
We're a slow maturing general purpose animal so most software will work: you can be a rat, bear (alot in glasgow), tiger, climb up wall, climb up mountains, fly, rally 'n rock and roll. Most humans get set in their ways ~ age 13 and are then difficult to reprogram.
I run on pumaware developed by Sharon for my career in thinking, fun, frolics, design-engineering and boatbuilding. I am a
socialist with it.
Posted by: sam, greenock on 8:38am Tue 4 Dec 07
[quote][bold]John Jamieson[/bold] wrote:
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.[/quote] Er..............how about "bribe"
John Jamieson wrote:
In honour of Mr. Ecclestone's generosity towards New Labour the sum of one million pounds is called a Bernie in some quarters. A Guinea is, of course, an amount of money just over one pound. I wonder if there is a suitable five letter name for an amount just under one thousand pounds? Just a thought.
Er..............how about "bribe"
Posted by: Vronsky, Scotland on 10:41am Tue 4 Dec 07
From the dictionary of modern Scots usage, 2100:
wendy:(n) etm. unknown
(1) a sum of money just under £1000
(2) an implausible defence of wrongdoing
(3) an over-promoted woman
...any others?
From the dictionary of modern Scots usage, 2100:
wendy:(n) etm. unknown
(1) a sum of money just under £1000
(2) an implausible defence of wrongdoing
(3) an over-promoted woman
...any others?
Posted by: Master Bates, a bothy in Arran on 11:27am Tue 4 Dec 07
I'm going with my friend, Giftie gie us, and his choice of "wanky" as the best denomination. It appeals to me for reasons I cannot altogether explain.
I'm going with my friend, Giftie gie us, and his choice of "wanky" as the best denomination. It appeals to me for reasons I cannot altogether explain.
Posted by: G Wright, Glasgow UK on 11:49am Tue 4 Dec 07
Blair and Brown aren't socialists - they are mass murderers. And they are Tories
--------------------
---------------
Widsum power - your excuses for the performance of your "socialist" party ring every bit as hollow as the now ubiqutous "Oh, they arent real muslims"
The last 3 scottish labour leaders in a row have now been mired in sleaze, copying their westminster bosses. Perhaps now people in Scotland will engage their brains when voting, and we will see an end of any fool being elected on the strength of a labour rosette.
FAO Keyboard-warrior Chris Walker:
"Scotland is a democratically socialist country. Socialism goes with the grain of things here. It's part of our DNA."
This is utter rubbish. In the 50s, half of Scotland voted Conservative. They burnt their bridges and so Labour ruled the roost for the past while. Labour are busy disgracing themselves, and so it will be time for another change - most likely to the SNP, but certainly not to any form of socialist.
" don't take lectures from anonymous posters, "Andy", especially with a narrative as infantile as yours."
How rude of you to continually insult other posters, Chris. Are you unable to conduct yourself appropriately? It wouldnt surprise me, though, if you are a socialist - see the conduct of the SSP chimps in parliament, before the electorate got well rid of them. You dont have to agree with other people, but at least show some basic manners. I had a laugh at you calling "Andy" infantile, at the same time referring to me as "G Wrong". Very credible, just like your politics :-)
Blair and Brown aren't socialists - they are mass murderers. And they are Tories
--------------------
---------------
Widsum power - your excuses for the performance of your "socialist" party ring every bit as hollow as the now ubiqutous "Oh, they arent real muslims"
The last 3 scottish labour leaders in a row have now been mired in sleaze, copying their westminster bosses. Perhaps now people in Scotland will engage their brains when voting, and we will see an end of any fool being elected on the strength of a labour rosette.
FAO Keyboard-warrior Chris Walker:
"Scotland is a democratically socialist country. Socialism goes with the grain of things here. It's part of our DNA."
This is utter rubbish. In the 50s, half of Scotland voted Conservative. They burnt their bridges and so Labour ruled the roost for the past while. Labour are busy disgracing themselves, and so it will be time for another change - most likely to the SNP, but certainly not to any form of socialist.
" don't take lectures from anonymous posters, "Andy", especially with a narrative as infantile as yours."
How rude of you to continually insult other posters, Chris. Are you unable to conduct yourself appropriately? It wouldnt surprise me, though, if you are a socialist - see the conduct of the SSP chimps in parliament, before the electorate got well rid of them. You dont have to agree with other people, but at least show some basic manners. I had a laugh at you calling "Andy" infantile, at the same time referring to me as "G Wrong". Very credible, just like your politics :-)
Posted by: Giftie gie us, Hunterston's on fire on 12:00pm Tue 4 Dec 07
To Vronsky, Scotland
I would direct your attention to a letter from a certain JK Doran in today's letters on this Wendy business. It is a veritable cracker. On that basis I suggest that a "doran" as a unit of currency might do the trick. And "a doran in my sporran" has a certain New Labour cache to it. Sung to the tune of Crimond aka 'Roamin in the Gloamin' it might usefully be utilised as Big Clunkin's choice for our new national anthem, which I submit is a clincher.
To Vronsky, Scotland
I would direct your attention to a letter from a certain JK Doran in today's letters on this Wendy business. It is a veritable cracker. On that basis I suggest that a "doran" as a unit of currency might do the trick. And "a doran in my sporran" has a certain New Labour cache to it. Sung to the tune of Crimond aka 'Roamin in the Gloamin' it might usefully be utilised as Big Clunkin's choice for our new national anthem, which I submit is a clincher.
Posted by: chris walker, west kilbride on 12:43pm Tue 4 Dec 07
With over 60 letters in the Herald these last few years, I really don't need a tutorial from G Wright/G Wrong or his wee pal "Andy" on how "to conduct myself". Ask the editor. Ask Lesley Riddoch. I do not "continually insult other posters", as anybody who actually reads my posts, will confirm. Only fools such as yourself are treated with a certain derision, and no wonder. Oh, and war criminals.
The "past while", as you so euphemistically put it, when the Tories have been extirpated in Scotland has now lasted more than half a century. Scottish literature, Scottish drama, Scottish letters and Scottish history have seen an "ethical and cultural socialist hegemony" established in Scotland, as our self-confidence as a people has been the more firmly anchored here. Or hadn't you noticed? Have you seen Black Watch?
That's why the Tories have beeen routed. That's why they are permanently finished here and don't they know it. That's why they cannot wait to wash their hands of us. They do not "connect" with the Scottish political discourse, just as you, who constantly refer to your "Britishness" while gainsaying your Scottishness, do not "connect". For that construct too, "Britishness", has withered away. Scotland doesn't "do Imperialism" anymore. Iraq has seen to that.
So, when you learn to grow up, spell correctly and stop spouting the rubbish you do on a daily basis, then I will stop pointing it all out. I cannot stand fairer than that, Wright/Wrong.
With over 60 letters in the Herald these last few years, I really don't need a tutorial from G Wright/G Wrong or his wee pal "Andy" on how "to conduct myself". Ask the editor. Ask Lesley Riddoch. I do not "continually insult other posters", as anybody who actually reads my posts, will confirm. Only fools such as yourself are treated with a certain derision, and no wonder. Oh, and war criminals.
The "past while", as you so euphemistically put it, when the Tories have been extirpated in Scotland has now lasted more than half a century. Scottish literature, Scottish drama, Scottish letters and Scottish history have seen an "ethical and cultural socialist hegemony" established in Scotland, as our self-confidence as a people has been the more firmly anchored here. Or hadn't you noticed? Have you seen Black Watch?
That's why the Tories have beeen routed. That's why they are permanently finished here and don't they know it. That's why they cannot wait to wash their hands of us. They do not "connect" with the Scottish political discourse, just as you, who constantly refer to your "Britishness" while gainsaying your Scottishness, do not "connect". For that construct too, "Britishness", has withered away. Scotland doesn't "do Imperialism" anymore. Iraq has seen to that.
So, when you learn to grow up, spell correctly and stop spouting the rubbish you do on a daily basis, then I will stop pointing it all out. I cannot stand fairer than that, Wright/Wrong.
Posted by: John J. Sheridan, Z'ha'dum on 1:12pm Tue 4 Dec 07
G Wright and Handy Andy
Chris Walker has always struck me as poster with good manners and common sense.
I see nothing here which is beyond the bounds of good taste and nothing more than gentle ribbing Mr Wrong ( I like that..it's called being funny !)
His letters to the Herald are always worth reading and usually hit the mark.
If you think Chris is bad and that he dishes out insults you are wrong.
Try a real ratbag like me if you want insults, I am happy to oblige as I don't have the moral compass, vocabulary and decency of Mr Walker.
And I am great at insults!
G Wright and Handy Andy
Chris Walker has always struck me as poster with good manners and common sense.
I see nothing here which is beyond the bounds of good taste and nothing more than gentle ribbing Mr Wrong ( I like that..it's called being funny !)
His letters to the Herald are always worth reading and usually hit the mark.
If you think Chris is bad and that he dishes out insults you are wrong.
Try a real ratbag like me if you want insults, I am happy to oblige as I don't have the moral compass, vocabulary and decency of Mr Walker.
And I am great at insults!
Posted by: Giftie gie us, Peripatetic Glasgow on 4:21pm Tue 4 Dec 07
I have just taken the trouble to revisit G Wright's postings today. He's (ab)normally bleating about poor people on welfare or Muslims and the like, you know the guys at the bottom of the pile, whom Tories such as him have so energetically helped traditionally. His homily today was on "good manners" aimed at another poster;"good manners" have allowed him to stay in the city of Glasgow, a place he viscerally hates and where he is not welcome, as so many have repeatedly told him.
Today's list of "good manners" as uttered by Wright/Wrong includes:
1. Socialism is a "cancer" (sic); has he met a cancer sufferer lately?
2. People in Scotland should "engage their brains when voting" -what utter contempt for fellow Scots;
3. The SSP are "chimps in parliament".
He is congenitally incapable of getting involved in grown-up political discourse. That's why he has to hide behind pseudonyms. And that's why his currency is the vocabulary of semi-literate insult.
Watch out for his next post and its total lack of intelligent content. Meantime spare us the homilies on "good manners". Coatbridge, I know you despise him too but please just take him back.
Thanks to Mr Sheridan for his support for Chris Walker on this racist character. I know Chris believes we must confront ignorance at all times. Was it Orwell who said that "Ignorance is Strength"? But people like Orwell pass G Wright by. But John J Sheridan knows how crucially important it is to act on Orwell's wise warning. Chris Walker should not waste his time or ours on such low-life.
I have just taken the trouble to revisit G Wright's postings today. He's (ab)normally bleating about poor people on welfare or Muslims and the like, you know the guys at the bottom of the pile, whom Tories such as him have so energetically helped traditionally. His homily today was on "good manners" aimed at another poster;"good manners" have allowed him to stay in the city of Glasgow, a place he viscerally hates and where he is not welcome, as so many have repeatedly told him.
Today's list of "good manners" as uttered by Wright/Wrong includes:
1. Socialism is a "cancer" (sic); has he met a cancer sufferer lately?
2. People in Scotland should "engage their brains when voting" -what utter contempt for fellow Scots;
3. The SSP are "chimps in parliament".
He is congenitally incapable of getting involved in grown-up political discourse. That's why he has to hide behind pseudonyms. And that's why his currency is the vocabulary of semi-literate insult.
Watch out for his next post and its total lack of intelligent content. Meantime spare us the homilies on "good manners". Coatbridge, I know you despise him too but please just take him back.
Thanks to Mr Sheridan for his support for Chris Walker on this racist character. I know Chris believes we must confront ignorance at all times. Was it Orwell who said that "Ignorance is Strength"? But people like Orwell pass G Wright by. But John J Sheridan knows how crucially important it is to act on Orwell's wise warning. Chris Walker should not waste his time or ours on such low-life.
Posted by: Big Jock, Falkirk on 1:22pm Wed 5 Dec 07
With reference to Alex Gallagher. May I liken his relationship with the Labour party to that of an abused partner in a relationship long past it's sell by date. Yes one side still loves the other but one side lies ,cheats,bullies and generally deceives the other. The fool for all that still loves the abusive partner and cannot bring themselves to leave them for the faint hope that things may go back to the way they were.
The fool is called Alex Gallagher!
With reference to Alex Gallagher. May I liken his relationship with the Labour party to that of an abused partner in a relationship long past it's sell by date. Yes one side still loves the other but one side lies ,cheats,bullies and generally deceives the other. The fool for all that still loves the abusive partner and cannot bring themselves to leave them for the faint hope that things may go back to the way they were.
The fool is called Alex Gallagher!
Posted by: Widsum Power, Kelvin Court Mansions on 2:43pm Wed 5 Dec 07
To Big Jock
The abused partner - very useful analogy. For that reason alone "Comical Alex" is more to be pitied than anything else, However, as any experienced marriage counsellor would confirm there is a recidivist dimension to such a relationship: the offending partner ie the one dishing out the abuse, simply cannot stop, while the recipient becomes masochistic. Both in a strict sense become serial offenders symbiotically. That's why New Labour stumbles from one crisis to the next. and that's why "Comical Alex" is desperately in need of help: that he is unaware of that need merely underscores its urgency. More of a tragedy than a comedy actually.
To Big Jock
The abused partner - very useful analogy. For that reason alone "Comical Alex" is more to be pitied than anything else, However, as any experienced marriage counsellor would confirm there is a recidivist dimension to such a relationship: the offending partner ie the one dishing out the abuse, simply cannot stop, while the recipient becomes masochistic. Both in a strict sense become serial offenders symbiotically. That's why New Labour stumbles from one crisis to the next. and that's why "Comical Alex" is desperately in need of help: that he is unaware of that need merely underscores its urgency. More of a tragedy than a comedy actually.
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